If you are a beginning student wondering where to start learning magick, or a more advanced practitioner looking to make your magick more effective, Augoeides is the place for you. Over the years I have published all sorts of material that at one time could only be found within the confines of lodges and secret magical orders. If you have questions, post them in the comments. I always try and do my best to answer them, and I always will.
3107 California Street NE
Minneapolis, MN 55418
This is a public event and all who can attend are welcome. You do not need to be an OTO initiate to attend. The classes are free, but we suggest a $5 donation to help cover temple expenses. Also, keep in mind that we follow a loose version of the Fight Club rule - if you show up, you have to do a ritual. But it can be any ritual from any tradition, as simple as you like, and if you don't know any rituals yet we'll talk you through performing something basic like the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram.
One Tuesday per month we hold our Via Solis Zodiacal Elixir Rites, which are announced here on Augoeides along with the ritual scripts on the preceding Mondays. These are also open to all who can attend, and the same suggested donation applies. But taking part in one of these group rituals counts as doing a ritual, so you won't have to do anything else.
In April of 2018 I participated in a series of online Enochian classes organized by Jason Augustus Newcomb. That series of Enochian Master Classes is now available and you can sign up here. Click here for a coupon code that will give you half off the registration price.
I also am considering doing more online classes at some point in the future, and will announce those here far enough in advance that everyone will have a chance to sign up. In the meantime, the following links organize the material I have posted here into what I hope is a coherent overall framework for study.
Also, feel free to send me a friend request on Facebook. My profile is here, and once we are friends you should get updates from this blog and my author blog in your news feed. I rarely post anything that personal on Facebook, since I use it to promote my books and these websites, so you shouldn't run into anything more controversial than what I post here on Augoeides.
Building a working model of magick is crucial for working out how to best accomplish various goals, set accurate expectations for the work, and "debug" your procedures when you run into problems. While this does constitute theory, it should be pointed out that an effective magical model should make testable predictions and conform to the scientific method as closely as possible. I say "as possible" because one of the key components of magick is consciousness, which we have yet figured out a way to measure accurately. This prevents "The method of Science" from being employed in its strictest sense, but at the same time it is an ideal for which I believe all magicians should strive.
This first series of articles covers various thoughts related to my model of magick an how it compares to others out there that are currently in use. While reading through it is not strictly necessary, I highly recommend it. What I do not recommend is waiting until you feel like you understand it all completely before you start doing any work. You should start learning to do the rituals I present here and practice them as soon as you can manage. You're not likely to hurt yourself if you do something wrong and there's no substitute for experience.
Regarding Magical Models
I generally think that the "quantum information model" that I propose in this series is currently the best model of magick that we have. Note that I specific "quantum" not because I see it as a synonym for "awesome" like some New Agers, but rather because it is vitally important to draw a distinction between quantum information, data, and language. The last two have nothing to do with quantum information. The number of facts we amass or web pages we create have no relation to the structure of the universe. And the fundamental weakness of the original "information model" of magick was that it confused semiotics and physics.
The Basic Rituals
Commentaries on the Basic Rituals
The following articles go over the basic rituals that I have written up commentaries on so far, including extended commentaries and experimental speculation related to them. As I do more of these, I will add them to this list.
Original Basic Rituals
These are some alternatives that I have written to the standard basic ritual forms discussed above. They can make for interesting experimentation, but I recommend you learn the standard versions first before moving on to any of these.
Most of the magical orders of the past have initiatory systems that you must go through before you are given any practical material at all. Further down this page I have my Path of Initiation too, but as I see it you can be doing practical work right away. While you want to cultivate illumination and realization as you work, odds at that there are a lot of issues in your life that can get in the way. So start off by eliminating or at least mediating those.
The Magical Powers listed after the various attributes are Descriptive, Not Prescriptive. The powers listed here are from Aleister Crowley's Liber 777, but they should not be treated as all you can do with any of these magical forces. For example, in many cases elemental magick can be used to accomplish similar goals to planetary magick. Earth can correspond to wealth and material prosperity, Water can correspond to love and relationships, Air can correspond to healing, and Fire can correspond to cursing and protection from curses. These are all in addition to their listed powers.
The Elemental Work
To be clear, I am an OTO initiate but not a member of any of the current A.'.A.'. organizations, and the rituals here were developed by Comselh Ananael, my magical working group. I offer none of my own opinions here regarding any of the A.'.A.'. teachers who have publicly identified themselves as such, and I expect that what they teach their students differs substantially from what is presented here. Nonetheless, we found this approach to be quite effective, and I think you will too.
If you don't have a daily magical practice, you will want to have that established before starting any of these rites. Refer back to my articles in the Basic Practices section for what that should look like. You should keep this practice up basically forever, or at least for the rest of your life.
This article on Improving Solve et Coagula explains why I work the elemental initiations in the order that I do, based on research done by my magical working group. Going in "density order" rather than "reverse YHVH" order seems to lead to a more balanced and stable manifestation of the elements within the student's sphere of consciousness.
Note that it generally takes at least six months or so of practicing the Holy Guardian Angel Invocation ritual daily in order to obtain and stabilize K&C, so it is a substantial undertaking. More traditional grimoire magicians can go back to the source and work the full Abramelin operation on which Liber Samekh is based, but bear in mind that may take even longer. One version of the Abramelin runs for six months, but the other runs for a full eighteen.
Personal Instruction
The magick class that I currently run is the Ritual Workshop event at Leaping Laughter OTO, the Minneapolis local body of Ordo Templi Orientis. We meet every Tuesday evening at 7:30 PM at our dedicated temple space. It is located at:3107 California Street NE
Minneapolis, MN 55418
This is a public event and all who can attend are welcome. You do not need to be an OTO initiate to attend. The classes are free, but we suggest a $5 donation to help cover temple expenses. Also, keep in mind that we follow a loose version of the Fight Club rule - if you show up, you have to do a ritual. But it can be any ritual from any tradition, as simple as you like, and if you don't know any rituals yet we'll talk you through performing something basic like the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram.
One Tuesday per month we hold our Via Solis Zodiacal Elixir Rites, which are announced here on Augoeides along with the ritual scripts on the preceding Mondays. These are also open to all who can attend, and the same suggested donation applies. But taking part in one of these group rituals counts as doing a ritual, so you won't have to do anything else.
In April of 2018 I participated in a series of online Enochian classes organized by Jason Augustus Newcomb. That series of Enochian Master Classes is now available and you can sign up here. Click here for a coupon code that will give you half off the registration price.
I also am considering doing more online classes at some point in the future, and will announce those here far enough in advance that everyone will have a chance to sign up. In the meantime, the following links organize the material I have posted here into what I hope is a coherent overall framework for study.
Social Media
I am pretty active on the Ceremonial Magick School Facebook group. You can send a request to join and as long as you give reasonable answers to a couple of questions, and you should be approved. Please make sure that you answer the questions - those are there to make sure that we're adding actual human beings and not bots or something in disguise.Also, feel free to send me a friend request on Facebook. My profile is here, and once we are friends you should get updates from this blog and my author blog in your news feed. I rarely post anything that personal on Facebook, since I use it to promote my books and these websites, so you shouldn't run into anything more controversial than what I post here on Augoeides.
Professional Spellcasting
As I mention in the FAQ, I'm not in the professional spellcasting business and don't do magical operations for clients. Working with clients requires a completely different temple setup and so forth than what I use for my personal work. That may change at some point in the future, but for now if you have questions about how to perform one of the operations I describe here, feel free to email me at scottm@iphouse.com or send me a message on Facebook (once we're friends). I always try to do my best to answer questions of that nature, and I think once you overcome the initial resistance to casting a spell you might very well get better results casting for yourself than you would from any professional for whom said operation is basically just a job.What Is Magick?
This is one of the most fundamental questions students ask. What is magick, and how does it work? While magick is a highly individual practice, there are some commonalities between schools, methods, and practitioners. My background is in the Thelemic school of modern ceremonial magick and the Hermetic tradition of the European Renaissance, particularly the works of Henry Cornelius Agrippa and John Dee. It was my interest in Dee's work that first prompted me to write the books that would eventually be published as my Mastering Enochian Magick Series.Building a working model of magick is crucial for working out how to best accomplish various goals, set accurate expectations for the work, and "debug" your procedures when you run into problems. While this does constitute theory, it should be pointed out that an effective magical model should make testable predictions and conform to the scientific method as closely as possible. I say "as possible" because one of the key components of magick is consciousness, which we have yet figured out a way to measure accurately. This prevents "The method of Science" from being employed in its strictest sense, but at the same time it is an ideal for which I believe all magicians should strive.
This first series of articles covers various thoughts related to my model of magick an how it compares to others out there that are currently in use. While reading through it is not strictly necessary, I highly recommend it. What I do not recommend is waiting until you feel like you understand it all completely before you start doing any work. You should start learning to do the rituals I present here and practice them as soon as you can manage. You're not likely to hurt yourself if you do something wrong and there's no substitute for experience.
Regarding Magical Models
I generally think that the "quantum information model" that I propose in this series is currently the best model of magick that we have. Note that I specific "quantum" not because I see it as a synonym for "awesome" like some New Agers, but rather because it is vitally important to draw a distinction between quantum information, data, and language. The last two have nothing to do with quantum information. The number of facts we amass or web pages we create have no relation to the structure of the universe. And the fundamental weakness of the original "information model" of magick was that it confused semiotics and physics.
Basic Practices
This article from 2006, this one from 2008, and this one from 2016 give an overview of what I recommend as an effective daily magical practice. Every magician should develop a sequence of basic rituals that he or she performs at least once per day, generally in the morning after waking up or at night before going to sleep. Which you prefer depends a lot on your personal circadian clock - I'm a total night owl and can't get anything done in the morning, so I do my practices at night before I go to sleep. Either should prove effective.The Basic Rituals
- The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram. This simple rite is generally considered the most basic modern ceremonial ritual, and one of the first bits of magick that modern magicians learn. It is a microcosmic banishing and invoking ritual. That is, it works on your personal consciousness. The banishing form clears, stabilizes, and cuts away connections that may be influencing you. The invoking form energizes and empowers your sphere of consciousness. Note that this ritual does not "clear a space" beyond your body's natural aura, though some magicians incorrectly use it that way.
- The Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram. This ritual is the macrocosmic counterpart to the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram. That is, it works on space in the external world beyond your personal consciousness. The banishing form of this ritual is commonly taught as a daily practice, but I strongly recommend against it. You don't want to shut down or send the forces of nature away. To do effective practical magick, you want to connect with and manipulate them - which is what the invoking form of this ritual does. The banishing form can be used to clear a space, but when using in conjunction with the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram it shuts down everything. That can include your own currently running operations.
- The Middle Pillar Ritual. I don't teach most of Israel Regardie's methods, but the Middle Pillar Ritual is an exception. It brings energy work and identification with the divine into daily practice.
- Meditation should also be taken up by aspiring students of magick. There are a lot of variations on meditation practice out there, but most of them produce similar effects. The method here is based on the simple non-sectarian "Mindfulness Meditation" method. You should try to meditate for about twenty minutes a day, which is entirely sufficient for magical work.
- The Greater Ritual of the Pentagram. This is mostly an overview of how I do the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram, with some light commentary. I wrote it up because there is a lot of conflicting information online about how to do the Greater Pentagram along with other rituals like the "Supreme Pentagram" (which I don't use or teach) and so forth. This ritual can be used as part of a daily practice, especially as a preliminary to more involved HGA work. It also is used for practical elemental work.
- The Greater Ritual of the Hexagram. This is my overview of the Greater Ritual of the Hexagram, which is used to tune your magical space for working with planets and zodiac signs just like the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram tunes your space for working with elements.
Commentaries on the Basic Rituals
The following articles go over the basic rituals that I have written up commentaries on so far, including extended commentaries and experimental speculation related to them. As I do more of these, I will add them to this list.
- Lesser Versus Greater Pentagrams. This article was written to dispel a particularly pernicious myth about the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram. Even though the pentagrams you are tracing are drawn in the same direction as Earth pentagrams, they are not exclusive to the element of Earth.
- Hacking the Elemental Hexagrams. This article digs into a speculative method for using the elemental hexagrams from the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram to work with the four Qabalistic worlds. It was written in part as a response to what I consider the dubious practice of doing "Lesser Hexagrams of the Planets." "Lesser" rituals are general and "Greater" rituals are specific. Neither is a "better" or "worse" version of the other - they serve entirely different functions.
- The Operant Field. This is one of the ideas that started it all, and my own small contribution to modern magick theory. Understanding the microcosmic and macrocosmic natures of the Lesser Pentagram and Lesser Hexagram points to more effective ways to work with these rituals, both in terms of daily practice and larger ceremonial operations. Try it out - you'll be surprised how much better this small change makes everything work.
- Microcosmic Versus Macrocosmic Rituals. This is a longer and more detailed article discussing the operant field as defined in the preceding article, how Lesser rituals are general and Greater rituals are specific, and how to get at the microcosmic and macrocosmic aspects of the various magical forces.
- Goetic Circles and Operant Fields. This article looks at some overlap between the operant field model and the magick circle found in a late grimoire, the Lemegeton or Lesser Key of Solomon.
- Wrapping Up The "Hexagram Controversy". This article discusses the reaction of the online magical community towards the operant field model, and ends with a simple challenge: try it. If you try out the operant field method and it doesn't improve your results, by all means don't keep using it. At the same time, many magicians who have tried it report that their results are better overall, happen faster, and are stronger and more stable when they use it.
- Thoughts on the Star Ruby. This article is my explanation of Aleister Crowley's "new and more elaborate version of the Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram." This ritual can be used to open an operant field in conjunction with the Star Sapphire, just as the Lesser Banishing Ritual can do the same in conjunction with the Lesser Invoking Ritual of the Hexagram.
- An Analysis of the Star Sapphire. This article is a comprehensive overview of my thoughts on the Star Sapphire, Aleister Crowley's "improved ritual of the hexagram." The Star Sapphire behaves a lot like a souped-up version of the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram, and should be used in conjunction with the Star Ruby, Crowley's "improved ritual of the pentagram."
- Regarding Devotional Work. This article summarizes some devotional methods for use by magicians, particularly those found in Aleister Crowley's Liber Astarte vel Berylli. Devotional rituals that you find inspirational and resonant with your will can be an important addition to your practice.
- Thoughts on the Rose Cross Ritual. I do not personally use the Golden Dawn Rose Cross Ritual, but I did some experiments with it back in the day and some readers have asked about my take on it. In theory, the ritual works to smooth out and balance magical forces and fields, but so far I have not been able to figure out anything practical to do with it that I would be able to formally test. The idea that it "confers invisibility" does not seem to stand up to strict scrutiny, even though a lot of people apparently believe it.
Original Basic Rituals
These are some alternatives that I have written to the standard basic ritual forms discussed above. They can make for interesting experimentation, but I recommend you learn the standard versions first before moving on to any of these.
- Revising the Keyword Analysis. This article covers a revised version of the Keyword Analysis from the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram that my magical working group developed.
- Comselh Ananael Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram. This is the version of the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram used by my magical working group, including the changes explained in the article on Hacking the Keyword Analysis.
- The Field Ritual. This is an experimental ritual developed at the Leaping Laughter Ritual Workshop that combines the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram and Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram along operant field lines.
Practical Magick
Once my students have a daily practice in place, I start them off with practical magick. That's one of the big differences between me and most other teachers. My main goal is to get you doing the work as quickly as possible, and getting good results as quickly as possible.Most of the magical orders of the past have initiatory systems that you must go through before you are given any practical material at all. Further down this page I have my Path of Initiation too, but as I see it you can be doing practical work right away. While you want to cultivate illumination and realization as you work, odds at that there are a lot of issues in your life that can get in the way. So start off by eliminating or at least mediating those.
The Magical Powers listed after the various attributes are Descriptive, Not Prescriptive. The powers listed here are from Aleister Crowley's Liber 777, but they should not be treated as all you can do with any of these magical forces. For example, in many cases elemental magick can be used to accomplish similar goals to planetary magick. Earth can correspond to wealth and material prosperity, Water can correspond to love and relationships, Air can correspond to healing, and Fire can correspond to cursing and protection from curses. These are all in addition to their listed powers.
The Elemental Work
- Earth. Alchemy, Geomancy, Making of Pantacles; Travels on the Astral Plane.
- Water. The Great Work, Talismans, Crystal-gazing, etc.
- Air. Divination.
- Fire. Evocation, Pyromancy.
- Saturn. Works of Malediction and Death.
- Jupiter. Power of Acquiring Political and other Ascendency.
- Mars. Works of Wrath and Vengeance.
- Sun. The Red Tincture, Power of Acquiring Wealth.
- Venus. Love-philtres.
- Mercury. Miracles of Healing, Gift of Tongues, Knowledge of Sciences.
- Moon. The White Tincture, Clairvoyance, Divination by Dreams.
- The Epilogue covers both the Planetary and Elemental Work series of articles, and addresses some of the questions that came up while I was posting the series.
- Aries. Power of Consecrating Things.
- Taurus. The Secret of Physical Strength.
- Gemini. Power of being in two or more places at one time, and of Prophecy.
- Cancer. Power of Casting Enchantments.
- Leo. Power of Training Wild Beasts.
- Virgo. Invisibility, Parthenogenesis, Initiation.
- Libra. Works of Justice and Equilibrium.
- Scorpio. Necromancy.
- Sagittarius. Transmutations; Vision of Universal Peacock.
- Capricorn. The Witches’ Sabbath so-called, the Evil Eye.
- Aquarius. Astrology.
- Pisces. Bewitchments, Casting Illusions.
The Path of Initiation
This series of articles is based on the published initiatory structure of Aleister Crowley's A.'.A.'. as found in One Star in Sight.To be clear, I am an OTO initiate but not a member of any of the current A.'.A.'. organizations, and the rituals here were developed by Comselh Ananael, my magical working group. I offer none of my own opinions here regarding any of the A.'.A.'. teachers who have publicly identified themselves as such, and I expect that what they teach their students differs substantially from what is presented here. Nonetheless, we found this approach to be quite effective, and I think you will too.
If you don't have a daily magical practice, you will want to have that established before starting any of these rites. Refer back to my articles in the Basic Practices section for what that should look like. You should keep this practice up basically forever, or at least for the rest of your life.
This article on Improving Solve et Coagula explains why I work the elemental initiations in the order that I do, based on research done by my magical working group. Going in "density order" rather than "reverse YHVH" order seems to lead to a more balanced and stable manifestation of the elements within the student's sphere of consciousness.
- Malkuth (Kingdom). The Vision of the Holy Guardian Angel or of Adonai.
- Yesod (Foundation). The Vision of the Machinery of the Universe.
- Hod (Splendor). The Vision of Splendour; Ezekiel.
- Netzach (Victory). The Vision of Beauty Triumphant.
Note that it generally takes at least six months or so of practicing the Holy Guardian Angel Invocation ritual daily in order to obtain and stabilize K&C, so it is a substantial undertaking. More traditional grimoire magicians can go back to the source and work the full Abramelin operation on which Liber Samekh is based, but bear in mind that may take even longer. One version of the Abramelin runs for six months, but the other runs for a full eighteen.
- Tiphareth (Beauty). The Vision of the Harmony of Things (also the Mysteries of the Crucifixion); Beatific Vision.
- Geburah (Power or Severity). The Vision of Power.
- Chesed (Glory or Mercy). The Vision of Love.
- Binah (Understanding). The Vision of Sorrow, Vision of Wonder.
- Chockmah (Wisdom). The Vision of God face to face, Vision of Antinomies.
- Kether (Crown). Union with God.
- The Three Veils. The Supreme Attainment; Vision of No Difference.
710 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 601 – 710 of 710Unfortunately there is not a hard and fast rule for that. It depends on the operation. Sometimes I see results right away and sometimes I see them after a few days.
Cool. Even a few days is fine for me fulfilling the Chaos narrative that the servitor needs to mature after birth. But I still did another evocation of the angel and charged her to further empower and speed up the rearing process followed by spirit scrying of the servitor and I saw that it was like a baby twiddling, and the book I'm following (called Magickal Servitors) recommends continuous feeding of attention to the servitor for it to rear, which evolved it from a baby to a cub(animalistic servitor). Now we'll wait and see how it does. I also have a few friends who have been employing servitors for years so I'm not that worried xD xD xD xD.
You have very few articles on servitors, can I request a new one? xD
Did you know that it is possible to work with someone's else's servitors?
I am not sure if the mechanism you describe there is really what is going on. I find some variation in how long it takes for a created spirit to "ramp up" and start showing results, but I don't know if it has anything to do with the "rearing process" or whatever. I just do the operation and wait and don't mess with it in any other way. The time to seeing first results just varies a lot.
When I get time to write one, sure. But what I think you'll find is that everything I say about talismans is also true of servitors. Basically a talisman just behaves like a servitor with a physical anchor. It's no more complicated than that.
Since a servitor is an independent spiritual entity and not a psychological projection, of course you can work with a servitor created by someone else - unless of course it was charged to only interact with the person who made it when it was created.
Hey Scott, I've learned recently that there are a few magicians such as the esteemed Christopher Warnock who make all their talismans on the same metal which is certainly not what the books recommend. Have you found that to work for you?
When you get back into th3 1400s and 1500s, you do not see the metals standardized like you do with modern Qabalistic magick. Warnock goes with what the grimoire he's working with specifies, which does vary depending on the source.
Personally I have limited experience with it, but my understanding is that a lot of magicians claim to get good results going with the metal the grimoire specifies.
Brass or Bronze as a substitute for all planetary metals is not from the Picatrix. He came up with that himself. Both are alloys which work for him and his customers. Besides, most make their solar talismans on brass anyway just like your PELE ring. I'll just go with brass/bronze once I find a cheap source that sells in stocks.
Between talismans and petitions which seem to have a higher success rate for you and why? Talismans are the hardest goal of magick.
How to make petitions last as long as talismans i.e years?
Just as a point, I do not substitute brass for all planetary metals and I do not generally make bronze talismans.
Brass can be substituted for gold on the basis of its color, Mercury on the basis of it being an alloy, and Venus on the basis on it being mostly copper.
Bronze can be used for Mercury on the basis of it being an alloy, Venus on the basis of it being mostly copper, and Jupiter on the basis of it containing tin - though it contains substantially more copper than tin and I generally use amethyst for Jupiter rather than a metal.
I still use iron for Mars, lead for Saturn, and silver for the Moon.
I don't do a lot of petitions, so I don't have a good enough sample size to make a comparison. I have had a lot of good results with talismans, though. I also haven't done enough work to speculate on how you would make a petition last over time, but my sense of it is that it would be pretty difficult.
Have returned with more knowledge about the decans. Turns out the decans are not zodiacal but planetary. It's a planet's position in a face/decan of the sign. Nothing zodiacal about them. This is why astrological magicians like the Picatrix community uses planetary elections, associations and materials for decan magick to complete effect. The only difference between us and them, they have no list of angels of the decans. They call/invoke the celestial spirit directly from the decan. The Moon is the most available planet for decan magick with 5 decans available a month.
Testament of Solomon is an extremely early source of 36 evil demons and their thwarting angels of the decans. Nick Farrell's Helios Unbound uses another source of 'daemons'. So the list of decan angels and demons varies from source to source. How do we know which is the accurate or the safest one to work with? Picatrix magicians avoid this issue entirely by invoking the nameless celestial spirit of the decan.
I also learned that the source for SOME of the decan angels that the Golden Dawn came up with is derived from the names found in Sefer Raziel. Mathers took these letters and spelled them out a bit differently for some reason. Compare 2nd decan of Aries angel BHMY(Raziel) with BHHMY (GD) and ABDRWN(GD) and ABDRWN(Raziel). Now I am convinced the list is accurate but to treat it as zodiac magick is inaccurate. This proves why the powers of the decans have little or nothing in common with the common powers of the sign.
As a second point, Saturn has been in its beneficial decan for over a year and it won't enter that decan again for another 30 years! God DAMN! I wasted entire 2023 not knowing that. Saturn will be exiting this decan on March 1 so I still have time to make use of its beneficent powers.
However, one or two applications are all this decan have to offer if we are not working general Saturn magick of course. Decans aren't that useful unfortunately. Can I also apply the principle of a force being able to accomplish something opposite of its powers, to decans?
The decans have more specific powers than the planets which limit their utility to a degree. On the other hand, that's fine if one of the listed powers is exactly what you need.
I would think that decans rule by sphere of influence just like elements, planets, and signs, so you could work with a decan to both increase or decrease things related to its powers. This is supported by reports of decan talismans made during poor elections having opposite effects.
I never have experienced that myself so I think it's probably pretty rare, but the fact that it can happen at all means that it's possible and probably can be done deliberately.
Yes but as we know that people who work with the decans never use our Golden Dawn list compiled by Mathers. Those angels are not even in ancient sources. No known list of decan angels existed prior. You can write an article about that because decan and term magick is all the rage these days.
So people who used that decan during a poor election to have adverse results followed the Picatrix procedure by not calling any angels by name. They simply burn the incense and say something like 'by the One Most High, may the spirit of Mercury (or any other force) enter this talisman' while they engrave the image. They never learn the name of the spirit who was sent into their talisman. I believe this is why their workings can go horribly for them and a bad election is always the reason.
We do it completely differently. We conjure an angel and tell it to consecrate the talisman. That is how I've got them to work following your method.
So the final decan mystery for me is, would this decan angel of Mathers deliver just as good as the otherwise picatrix entity would have.
I'd have to practice. The Moon grants 5 decans to work with every month, that is the only planet that offers the most decan opportunities but most of them have limited use which is why I wanted to know if their opposite powers were also possible.
As we know? That actually is not true. I know a number of people who do decan magick with the Mathers list and report good results. It is true that the Golden Dawn list is not in ancient sources, so you can certainly decide not to use it on those grounds. But to say nobody does, or that those who do don't get good results, is as far as I can tell not true at all.
Obviously you can't do Picatrix magick during poor elections. I don't know that I agree that things will always go badly for you if you do, but operations done on poor elections are not going to work well if they work at all. I also don't know of anyone who does this sort of magick without naming the spirit, but if they are out there I agree that it's a bad way to do it and probably won't produce good results.
As far as operations going "horribly wrong" I have to say I have yet to hear of a spell failure that really fits that description - like ever. Whereas I know of plenty of cases where operations just don't work - that is, they produce no apparent effects. That's the most common outcome with poorly done rituals. I also know of many cases where people were careless with charges and got what they asked for but not what they wanted. Those are common too.
The one person I know of online who I know of making claims that he had friends who "died horribly" from doing magick wrong is Clifford Low, and honestly I just don't believe him. I've been a part of the magical community here in the Twin Cities for over 30 years (Clifford and I are close to the same age, mid fifties) and known a lot of people who have done magick, both well and poorly. If magick kills people who do it wrong, I should be able to think of one case of it from all that time - and I can't. As far as I can tell it just doesn't happen. So I have no idea what Clifford is on about besides trying to stir up drama and get attention.
Do these people work with Mather's decan angels Solomonically meaning by conjuration or do they simply write the name of the angel on the talisman along with the picatrix image while they suffumigate it with the proper incense? The author of the Picatrix would be surprised to hear that we have found a list of angels for the decans thanks to Mathers.
Of course, I intend to work with the Mathers list. However I want to know if I can avoid the image because now we know the name of the spirit, I don't want to be a slave to the image. Picatrix magicians don't have this option and so their choice is limited only to the function of the image of the decan, but unlike the images, spirits can do many things.
Also in which house do you place pathworking? Since it is a thing of divination, house 9 was what people recommended me; the house of divination. I wish to pathwork to these angels but do you think that pathworking to Gabriel and asking her my questions about the specific powers of the lunar decans as well as the lunar mansions would be proper or should one pathwork to the specific angel of the aspect?
Also, when you're doing elemental magick, do you still use talismans which are for a permanent charge or do you prefer petitions?
I do not necessarily know all the details of practice from folks reporting results, but I generally think people who work with the Mathers list would be doing Golden Dawn or Thelemic style magick rather than Picatrix style stuff. Some of my students have found you can combine the methods and it seems to work - go through the conjuration of the angel, draw the image on the talisman, and then deliver a more specific charge than the general power related to the image.
Gabriel should have that information. As the general angel of the Moon, you probably are more likely to get a correct answer than if you are trying to guess at the right house angel. I don't work with the houses very much, but divination seems like a logical attribution to me.
I will either (A) create a talisman to anchor the effect or (B) directly deliver a charge to the spirit. I don't really work with petitions aside from a few experiments years ago, unless you consider (B) a petition. I personally don't - I see it as a charge.
>(B) directly deliver a charge to the spirit. I don't really work with petitions aside from a few experiments years ago, unless you consider (B) a petition.
I thought all this time that you meant (B) to be a petition. How do you have a different definition of petitions? So far, we only have one definition of a petition and that is (B), delivering charge directly to the spirit or as Picatrix does, directly to the hierarchy of spirits. However, I've not come across the idea anywhere that a petition anchors the operation to the magician. They do agree though that it lasts a few years but is not perpetual.
As for divination, a few weeks ago I did a divination prior to an Air ritual that clearly said that the operation will fail but I went ahead with it nonetheless for experimentation's sake and indeed it failed. The spirits failed. Geomancy divination is really hard as it is, so I don't know why it failed but I'm glad the truth was ascertained prior to the failure. However, it did smack the confidence out of me regarding the 4 elements.
How do you decide to do it all over again or choose a different power entirely?
I have another question, this time about incense. I recently met a Picatrix practitioner who told me he uses frankincense for all planets successfully. This statement is repeated within the magickal community in general, but everyone prefers their list of incenses in the grimoires. Even Saturn loves frankincense according to some accounts. Can you tell me a bit about it from your experience?
Okay, just wanted to make sure we were talking about the same thing. I was not clear on that for a minute there. In my experience direct charges like that do anchor to the magician, and the more you have going at once the less powerful each will be. That's not from any esoteric source that I can point to, it's a finding from my own research. Take that as you will.
You can do multiple divinations. Start with "If I do this operation calling on power X, what will happen?" If you get back that it will fail, see what you can tweak to fix whatever the problem is. There's some overlap between the various powers, so you could find another power that could potentially match and try "What if I do this operation calling on power Y instead of power X?" and then see what the divination says. Once you identify a successful power, go with that.
Incenses are pretty flexible. You don't necessarily need to use the exact planetary incense from 777 or anything like that. Frankincense in particular can be used for a lot of different powers and they don't seem to mind. So I'm not surprised somebody would report using it for all the planets successfully.
Yes, I went ahead with the Air talisman despite the divination foretelling the outcome for experimentation's sake. The only thing different I could have done was choose a different election, a different element or a different way of conjuring the spirits. The other 3 elements are still a possible candidate for the outcome I am seeking.
I wish to share that my Libra talisman has failed to deliver, and the deadline has passed. Looking at the election, I accidentally missed the date by a day causing the Moon to be afflicted by Jupiter. My geomancy divination showed the court to be unsure: conjunctio as the judge meaning that it chances were very slim. And H4 (House 4) showed Amissio (loss) which means that at the end of the matter, there will be loss which I take to mean the ritual will fail. And the house of the target also came up with an ambiguous sign. Man it's unbelievable how accurate divination is. When it says no, it means no. When it says yes, it means yes. When it says 'depends, not sure', it means it could go either way. Had I not missed the original election by a day as intended, perhaps Zuriel might have achieved.
Let's just assume that Libra was the most appropriate power for that task, what could I have done differently? For one, I did not pathwork to Zuriel to ask for his approval, so no introductions there. I only conjured him and gave the charge.
As for pathworking, yesterday I did a pathworking to Gabriel inside Yesod, however geomancy divination afterwards revealed that I in fact did not pathwork to Gabriel, Carcer as judge. Though it did seem convincing to me. So I guess I need to try it again and again? I asked Gabriel for a personal name to connect with her and she gave 'Levanah' which just means Moon in Hebrew, so there's a clue that it might have been my imagination.
For comparison, I was once about to do my first pathworking to Hanael of Capricorn and divination discouraged it for the night. Then I did it a few days later and divination indeed confirmed that the pathworking was successful and the answers Hanael gave such as the directions to face for her, the incense she likes but nothing more.
So how is it that divination can say whether a time is right for a pathworking or not? Should we listen to divination about whether it's ok to do a pathworking or should we do a pathworking first and divine whether we actually communicated with the spirit or not. Both are equally viable to me but it seems divination still prefers to tell us what is right or wrong.
As I see it you can do it either way. I would leave that up to your personal preference, or what feels right at the time you do the operation.
I have a concern against using talismans for everything. For example, grimoires recommend to place talismans near or in the place you want to affect. So a talisman to make a place safer should be in there, a talisman to make a place more corrupt should be near the place. Likewise, when you make a talisman to heal a relative living abroad, how do they even get to benefit from it if it is not in on their person? Surely, petitions must have *some* benefit over talismans?
Talismans need to be linked to a target, using similarity or contagion links. Then they do not need to be physically close to what you want to affect. You can also link them to yourself this way and then you do not need to carry them around or wear them. A direct operation/petition has the same issue. For it to work on a distant target you need a magical link in the table of art when you do the conjuration.
The advantage of a direct operation/petition is that they are a little more powerful if they are the only operation you have running. Some of the power you raise when you create a talisman is taken up by stabilizing the talisman itself. Because of this, I was able to determine experimentally that talismans produce about 80% of the probability shift of a direct operation. However, if you have more than one going at the same time your magical power gets split between all the operations you have running.
A talisman is independent and does not have that limitation. You can have a million talismans going if you want and they won't affect your available magical power. If you're not happy with 80% of the effect that a talisman will produce, make two of them in separate operations. Each will run at 80% of the direct operation shift and give you 160% of what you could do with a petition/direct operation.
But as I always say, those are my findings. Feel free to experiment for yourself and see if you get different results.
I assume that you found these conclusions after charging the same spirit(s) via petitions and talismans for the same task, most probably a one-off task, at different times otherwise it would become incredibly difficult to ascertain the results because
(a) your relationship with the spirit would improve with each charge which enhances the results, correct?
(b) the circumstances changed with the election and the situation affecting the results
Astrological magicians do tell me that talismans have advantages over petitions but only minimal and that too in quantity only; firstly, being that the talisman can function perpetually and secondly being that petitions permit the spirits to have a broader reach, whereas the talisman is localized. They tell me that they do petitions for other people primarily who would never wear a talisman.
You and others who follow the same pattern of conjuring a spirit and charging it to empower a talisman with X purpose on the other hand, might have revolutionized the method. Agrippa gives zero details on how to work with petitions and Picatrix was translated much later.
And as you told me before, for a continual purpose a talisman will be perfect for it can operate on the issue perpetually and they also told me that a petition has more horsepower like you found yourself.
But what about Enochian? Does this extend to Enochian magick too?
Also, are there spirits with whom the results don't improve over time?
I am well aware that the testing I have done is difficult and not necessarily conclusive. That is why I recommend you do your own experiments instead of relying on my opinions. You might get different results than I did. But if you ask my opinions, they are going to be based on my own experiments because that is the information that I have obtained over years of working with this material.
Yes, Enochian works the same way in my experience.
I would expect that hostile spirits that don't really want to work with you probably would not get better over time. I can't be sure about that, though, since usually if a spirit is hostile towards something I want to get done I just find another one with similar powers that is more willing to be helpful.
Scott, which powers would be best for cancellation of something? Such as an event, program, activity etc. You probably best experience with this type of magick because you have done political magick.
I have a few candidates but I have no clue which would be the best: Saturn/Earth (restriction and root cutting), Jupiter/Sagittarius (transformation), Moon/Cancer (magnetization of cancellation), Libra (equilibrium), and Pisces (ending of things).
Libra didn't work for me on an entirely different issue so it would be my last pick.
Saturn is the most obvious. It is directly related to ending things and restricting things.
Sagittarius could also work, since transformation is a pretty general power.
Something ending is not very "magnetizable," if that makes sense. So I wouldn't go with Cancer.
Libra is "works of justice and equilibrium," so I wouldn't go with that either.
Pisces is "bewitchments and casting illusions," which doesn't seem very related. So I wouldn't go with that.
I would say if you want to go planetary, Saturn is good. If you wan to go zodiacal, go with Sagittarius. Elemental the best would probably be Earth - it's cold (lack of energy/activity) and dry (immutable in structure).
I think Cancer is wrong. It can be asked to magnetize the event with the desired circumstances but not the end of the event itself.
I knew you would pick Saturn first because it is the most obvious choice but I can't help but feel that Jupiter and Sagittarius are also proper candidates. This is because Jupiter rules power, prestige. Sagittarius is even better because it rules higher education, so imagine cancelling an event in an educational institution or related to it.
I mentioned Pisces because one astrological power of Pisces is ending of journeys like how Aries denotes the beginning of journeys (fire). It's not in 777.
Also, I just came up with this now. Moon and Mercury are the planets people go to for road opening spells so I think they can be asked to close the road as well, which isn't exactly the same as cessation of things. And moon elections pop up twice every month.
Scorpio is the sign of death, of both individuals and situations(devil card). Mars, as you write is too extreme for things Saturn can easily do so I assume that Scorpio likewise can be called for swift endings. Saturn is considered a slow and melancholic planet of rot and decay. The grimoires always describe Scorpio for driving something out, such as Scorpios from your city.
So in conclusion I think it depends on the wording of our charge. If we say, "Barakhiel, use the power of your sign Scorpio to bring a swift 'death' to this event."
Or, "Gabriel/Raphael, use your powers of road opening to close off this event."
Or, "Sachiel use your powers of political ascendancy to demote this event".
Coming back to Cancer, have you been able to use its enchantment power to cause or influence major change, especially towards political magick? I just think that the zodiac powers line up more perfectly with political goals.
It absolutely depends on your charge and how you put it together. I suspect any of those could be made to work, just have not tried all of them. It is important too to look at the condition of specific planets or signs. Even if the power might generally be the best one for the job, the wrong aspect or placement can make it less effective than it might otherwise be, and going with a different power might work better.
I have not tried Cancer for political operations myself, but I don't see a reason that it wouldn't work. Enchantment is a pretty general power.
Now I actually really want you to do a non-enochian Cancer talisman for political grifs xD xD xD.
You live in Minnesota right? I imagine that the city has political problems like every other city in the world and Muriel can be forced into the talisman to cause the change.
Is it the same as with other signs that Cancer's magnetization power takes a lot of time to start magnetizing? I made mine last week with a clear intention but I'm still result-free despite divination foretelling that it's very well worth doing this operation.
Hey Scott. We've discussed the stages of divination before doing spellwork and we've agreed that it's worth it especially if it agrees with doing magick but what if you did an operation and waited for two months and did not see any results and the need was being felt more than ever and so you did a follow up reading to know how it's working and it returned that we have to part ways with this dud of a talisman because, like we suspected, it didn't do anything?
I have so many other things on my list that I do not imagine getting to that any time soon. Feel free to try it yourself and report back, though.
Yes, all the zodiac signs tend to take more time to manifest. Changes are generally bigger but take longer than with elements and planets.
Sometimes talismans just don't work and that's the way it goes. It's hard to diagnose the problem reliably, since magick is by its nature kind of chaotic. After decades of practice I usually don't get those, but they still do happen from time to time.
That's what's nice about using a deadline. The deadline expires and you can see whether it worked or not. If it didn't, cast again for another similar period and see. I've gotten duds, but not two in a row.
In addition to divination, it's important to look for partial successes. If some things went the way of the charge but it wasn't fulfilled completely, it could mean that the charge is for something too unlikely for the talisman to completely shift.
Maybe Minnesotans don't deserve good things xD.
I understand that the zodiac signs have those powers precisely because the signs represent archetypal qualities best. Even now when I discuss simple things like wealth and health in regard to the signs, they dismiss is immediately. It would be cool if people experimented with the signs more.
I consulted with geomancy regarding if asking Kambriel to empower an Aquarius talisman to affect a few other future talismans with the intention to overcome, mitigate the negative aspects so as to enhance the astrological effects on the talismans I wanted to make for a particular goal so I won't be calling on Kambriel for that. If you have practically found this power to be true, then my chart was lying to me. In geomancy, you just throw dice and interpret the answer.
However, I asked whether Ghob could be useful for a different purpose and it agreed, and this was a no brainer because the goal corresponds directly to Earth and probably also because elements are available 24/7. This proves to me that the divination gods are cowards, because I also learned from it that a lunar mansion will also be great for me but Sun, Jupiter and Saturn won't. I threw charts for a few Shem angels, a few zodiacal archangels such as Adnakhiel and it all returned no. When it settled on an entirely different zodiacal archangel, which also makes sense to be honest, I understood why Earth would be the best power for this purpose, both elementally and zodiacally.
However, going with elemental operations, I don't want to be low on power. You were experimentally able to find out that two talismans bring up the power to about 160% and I think that's 10x worth going for than other options. Hell even 3 separate talismans by the same elemental King will work towards the purpose. You already agree with this. I think it can work.
But wouldn't the different elections empower the talismans differently? How can they harmoniously work towards the same goal without interfering? Have you confirmed something there as well?
Also, could a slow or weak additional talisman weaken the overall power output of both talismans? Imagine Paralda going both ways and getting split in the middle like a Tom and Jerry episode lmao xD.
Now I don't know why geomancy said that Kambriel and Adnakhiel would have been horrible talismans for my goal. But maybe having two or three of those talismans might have negated the negative effects. We will never know.
The Enochian approach works so well that if I have something I need done, I am not going to screw around with something that might not work as well. I would want to do some experiments in less crucial contexts to verify. And right now I don't have a lot of time for that. It is what it is.
Yes, the fact that the multiple talismans will have different elections does mean that their power will vary to a degree, because the election locks in the astrological conditions for how each talisman will work. Ideally you would find decent elections for all of them and then there should only be a slight variance.
Each talisman is its own unique entity. When you have a talisman empowered by, say, Paralda, it's not Paralda doing the the things the talisman is charged to do. It's more like a servitor or something created by Paralda that accomplishes those tasks. So the elections are entirely independent. Adding a talisman with a bad election to a group won't help much because it won't do much, but it won't degrade the power of others in the group.
Then what is Muriel even good for?
Muriel's powers are those outlined in my article on The Zodiacal Work - Cancer.
https://ananael.blogspot.com/2017/02/the-zodiacal-work-cancer.html
Also potentially anything else related by astrologers to the sign Cancer.
xD xD xD. No I mean, in the context of our ongoing conversation where you said the Enochian approach to zodiacal magick works so well that you don't need to experiment with the hermetic approach to Cancer, what is even the point in your personal practice to work with Muriel?
Enochian magick will be the death of all hermetic magick.
I said Enochian worked so well for political operations specifically. For Muriel's other powers that's not necessarily the case.
I said nothing there about Enochian versus Hermetic magick in general. You're reading that into my comments.
Yes I remember you telling me that the Enochian Zodiacal system, is first and foremost for political operations involving the Parts of the Earth. For that it's the best system you've ever come across and when using the Zodiacal angels of the Aires for Hermetic zodiacal powers such as those from 777 you found them to be on par.
In both cases, we only get one spirit for the sign; the zodiacal King and the zodiacal Agrippa archangel.
Have you ever experimented by calling both of them? I know that Enochian and Hermetic Kabbalah should not be mixed together but I see no reason why each can't work independently.
As you answer that, can you tell me whether we can do magick during this solar eclipse? Astrological magicians are not considering it but I want to know your thoughts.
Secondly, I want to share that I believe I have build a sort of relationship with Sandalphon over the past few weeks. Any elemental ritual I do, I call him first to act as an intermediary as I place his lunar kamea sigil on the table and conjure him in the name of ADNI Melekkh. Once the timer goes off, I conjure the elemental king through him, so these double conjurations take me 10 minutes.
Sandalphon himself does not get any charge but the elemental king. Is this how a relationship is built in practice? I believe I have done it.
Each time I have conjured a King this way, geomancy has shown that it was indeed successful. Last time I conjured Michael of fire to consecrate a talisman and burned some expensive frankincense incense. The divination showed that he was not conjured and the talisman also feels like a dud. So it seems to me that Sandalphon while very powerful - being an archangel - does not have any authority to force any spirit that is uninterested. This is something that my pathworking with Raziel a long time ago confirmed for me as well.
I am not going to tell you that you can or can't do magick during an eclipse. The traditional sources generally say no, which is why the astrological magicians aren't considering it. That may be good advice.
However, I have done some magical work during eclipses before, working with both the Sun and Moon, and I am going to be trying something for this one. Previous operations have worked to a degree, though I can't say that I've had an especially outstanding result. It's possible that the eclipse energy messes with energy of the ritual a bit instead of doing anything helpful. But that's something that I'm still trying to work out.
What I will tell you is that nothing catastrophic has ever happened to me doing magick during an eclipse. The worst that happens is the operation doesn't work well, and I'm not sure why some operations work fine and others don't.
For building a relationship with a spirit, yes, that's how you do it. You keep working with the same spirit over time and "getting to know them," so to speak. I haven't personally worked with Sandalphon as an intermediary, but if it's working for you keep going with it.
Are there any spirits of Kether, Chokhmah or Malkuth in Enochian system? If so that would be great.
Apologies for the delay, I have been out of town for a few days.
The problem with that sort of attribution in the Enochian system is (1) it's not clear that the attributions in the system are Qabalistic at all and (2) the Enochian system predates the both the Kircher Tree of Life and the Rosenroth Tree of Life that Mathers used as the basis for the Golden Dawn system. It's pretty clear in Enochian how to map to planets, elements, and signs but not so much beyond that.
You can connect Saturn with Binah and the zodiacal Angelic Kings with Chockmah based on Kircher/Rosenroth, but it's not clear at all what would map to Kether. Maybe LIL, the First Aire? But that doesn't necessarily map cleanly either.
Apology accepted.
If there is no such attribution, then I would take Metatron, Raziel and Sandalphon as angels set higher than any Enochian king. I mean how can there be something equivalent to the archangels of the sephirot in another system? Sephirots are abstract ideas that give rise to the paths right? The Gnostic Aeons. The highest of the highest. The supercelestial set above the celestial. In other words, can never be anything higher than Metatron, Raziel and Sandalphon.
Hi Scott,
I have a question about the classification of the Goetic Spirit, Bifrons.
Some sources classify him as being a spirit of Jupiter. According to some of the information on Astrology I found online, Jupiter, while influencing politics, also influences spirituality and education. So, would Jupiter be correct for him? Or would Mercury or the Moon be more appropriate?
Bifrons:
His Office is to make one knowing in Astrology, Geometry, and
other Arts and Sciences. He teaches the Virtues of Precious Stones
Planet: Jupiter and Woods. He changes Dead Bodies, and puts them in another
place; also he lights astral Candles upon the Graves of the
Dead.
Thanks.
As a caveat for this question, I have done very little work with Goetic spirits. So I may not be the best person to ask, and my thoughts on this might not be very useful.
A question - are there other sources relating Bifrons to Mercury or the Moon? Or just to Jupiter? If your sources say Jupiter and Mercury or Moon is more like a guess on your part, go with Jupiter and see how it works. The grimoires are attributed the way they are for a reason.
Once you learn the established way of working with them, feel free to experiment. But I usually find that people who look at a grimoire and want to change stuff before even working with it don't generally get good results.
Then how to take the relationship with Sandalphon further? I only call him when I need to call another spirit in the table of art via conjuration. Sometimes I feel it worked, sometimes it didn't because results would not pull through so I just took to conjuring him prior to any other conjuration in the hopes that he would appear more and more often in case he wasn't.
I personally don't work with Sandalphon that way so it's hard to give you advice that isn't just speculation. Generally speaking, though, you build a relationship with a spirit by working with them and doing operations with them. I would expect that your relationship with Sandalphon should deepen over time with repeated workings.
Your favorite metal for Mercury? I'm interested in hearing about the various metals for Mercury you have experimented with.
Since no alloys are the same, I think alloys that are closest to Mercury's nature would work best. So an amalgam alloy. The Solomonics recommend 'mixed metals'.
I use brass quite a bit because it is an alloy that is easy to get at places like home improvement stores. Titanium and aluminum also work nicely. Neither of those were available in the Renaissance because of difficulty processing and working with them.
If you're looking for something close to Mercury's nature, I believe it is possible to create an alloy that includes actual quicksilver and still is solid at room temperature. I haven't experimented with that myself, but it seems like a logical thing to try if you can get ahold of it.
Have you found it true in practice that Mercury (and Virgo and Gemini) does improve learning abilities or are you in favor of other powers?
The best students and employees are those who get the job done fastest by constantly applying themselves without stopping. Even gamers sometimes when trying out a new game or trying to get better at their performance will spend hours and all nighters trying to learn every aspect of the game, so is it even accurate to say that learning pursuits are under Mercury and not Saturn?
Picatrix magicians have told me that Saturn occupies a significant role in mentation because in those days, survival was of utmost importance and survival is under Saturn just like death. And you need discipline to survive, not faith or hope.
Looking at it zodiacally, Aries traditionally is the best power for starting new projects...where there needs to be tremendous power to overcome obstacles.
Gemini and Virgo would be for learning, creativity, and organisation. Cancer would be to magnetize oneself for near constant learning. Leo for improving the overall quality of our study habits if other signs have not already taken care of that. Virgo also for initiating oneself into a phase of learning. Pisces to ensure we have our road map followed to a successful conclusion.
Have you seen the modern tech stack for a simple fullstack web developer? Html, css, javascript, tailwind, bootstrap, Sass, typescript, node.js or asp.net core, sql, docker, kubernetes, React, Angular or Vue. The list is endless.
I do find that Mercury works well for learning.
However, other planets and signs can also help in their own particular ways. Everything you mention sounds workable and helpful.
I'm a software developer by trade, so yes, I'm familiar with all of those. The good news is that you don't use all of them on one project. Every project has its own subset.
We haven't discussed metals so far for the elements. Do elements even have metals associated with them?
Elements don't even have colors. The GD assigned them colors and so some think you can use any metal for all the 4 elements, but I think that's just lazy. My choice, generally, would be metals associated with the planets that have most rulership over each element as well as the goal of the operation. So generally, iron (Mars) for fire, brass/Aluminum for air, lead/pewter and iron for earth, tin and brass for water.
The brass I was sold cost me a hefty price. So now I'm looking towards aluminium for Mercury and his signs while I keep that brass for solar and Leo talismans.
Would you say that Aluminium is just as long lasting and effective as brass in your works for Mercury and his signs?
There is this guy on Facebook who claimed that Aluminium is not as good as brass because it is not a very balanced alloy whereas brass has a more equal share of mixed metals.
I could buy aluminium 13x cheaper here than what brass cost me per disc.
Right, using the metal for the planet associated with the element is probably the best way to go for this.
I find brass and aluminum both work. I don't know what is meant by "more balanced alloy," since brass is an alloy and aluminum is not. Brass doesn't have that balanced a mix of metals, either. It's mostly copper.
So I think using aluminum is fine. I haven't noticed any problems with it in my work.
My astrological magician friend and I made the same Aries talisman with Mars in Aries, and Moon in Aries too. My election was even better than him I'd say because I put the Moon in positive aspect with a benefic. He made his on bronze by engraving, I made mine on iron using correction fluid. We both called Melchaidel but with a significantly different approach. He didn't evoke but simply presented the talisman to the spirit bearing that name and asked him to send a spirit of Aries inside his talisman to bring the general benefits of Aries into his life and noticed increase in sex drive and personal energy. This is how picatrix magicians work. I did it our way by evoking Melchaidel to empower the talisman with a summary of its purpose to keep me occupied with my longterm and intermediate goals. He lit frankincense and dragon's blood. I only had the former
We both carry it in our bags; mine specifically in my wallet.
After 3 weeks, I have no clue if it's working or not. He told me afterwards that you have to engrave on it as correction fluid or paint can wear off, which may cause the spirit to have second thoughts about consecrating the talisman. Could this be it?
Indeed I spent all the days following it working towards my goals but I just can't chalk it up to the talisman. And now I may totally forget about the talisman and nothing may change. I wish I hadn't wasted that election using correction fluid even though my iron talisman contains more characters this his simple Aries glyph talisman. I have no way to evaluate its performance.
I also don't want to throw this talisman (at least until Mars enters Scorpio) in case it's working, despite super weakly. Zodiacal magic is truly the hardest magic to test.
Mr. Stenwick
What was the source material for your planetary, elemental and astrological rituals?
You said once before that the Star Ruby pushed out more than the Lesser Banishing ritual,
could you please elaborate?
Also Shoemaker on his video Living Thelma said that the "Magick in Theory" version seemed
like a work in progress (rough draft)because Crowley did not competed before his death? "
and because some of the correspondences did't line up. Shoemaker says
prefers the Book of lies version better? He says that Crowley used
the traditional Lbr mor often than the "Star Ruby."
Do you agree or diagree?
Thanks J,
jbyers2@tx.rr.com
Mr. Stewick,
When trying to learn a ritual for yourself, would you you use the "Outline or Key
Points" of the ritual?
Or would this cause problems? I read before that there is no such thing as a practice ritual.
If so how would you go about learning a ritual?
When the results of a ritual does not go as planned, as general rule what or who is the
culprit?
The most obvious answer is the practitioner screw up. Right? But isn't that the reason
practicing? How would you avoid making a mistake in the first place?
Thanks J,
jbyers2@th.rr.com
@Samat: I have not personally used correction fluid to mark a talisman like that, but I have used ink and paint and never have had a problem with either. So I can't say that's necessarily what's going on.
@J: The deal about the Star Ruby "pushing out" more than the LBRP is a feeling I get when using it, not something I can easily quantify. The LBRP disconnects you from things that are latched onto your sphere of sensation, while the Star Ruby seems to disconnect and kind of push those things away from you at the same time.
Some magicians do like the Book of Lies version better. I use the later revision myself, though, as do most of the Thelemic magicians I know. Crowley would have written that version by the 1920s and never revised it, so it wasn't something he was actively working on at the end of his life. It doesn't really seem like a "rough draft" to me - and the important thing is that it does work.
Crowley did use the LBRP more in the rituals he recorded in his diaries and published in The Equinox. It's important to note, though, that he didn't finalize the Star Ruby until the 1920s and Volume I of the Equinox was published from 1910 to 1915. The Book of Lies was something like 1913. That suggests to me that he wasn't necessarily happy with the Book of Lies version, hence the later revision.
I absolutely will walk through rituals in parts when learning them. But you also have to understand that making a mistake when practicing them is not going to hurt you. If anyone is telling you that, it's a silly superstition. Rituals very rarely "go wrong" aside from just not working. And when they don't work there's no general rule because we don't have a good general theory of magick. At this point you just have to look at all the variables and assess.
Mr. Stenwick
What was the source material for your planetary, elemental and astrological rituals?
Thanks J,
jbyers2@tx.rr.com
Liber 777, first and foremost, for all the Greater forms and spirit names.
https://hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib777
Crowley and Fuller's Liber 963 for the zodiacal readings after the Greater Hexagram, and also a bunch of stuff in the Path of Initiation articles.
https://hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib963
Orphic hymns for the planetary readings after the Greater Hexagram.
https://sacred-texts.com/cla/hoo/index.htm
The basic elixir structure for planets, signs, and elements is adapted from Denning and Phillips' Planetary Magick and expanded to include working with signs and elements.
https://www.amazon.com/Planetary-Magick-Invoking-Directing-Philosophy/dp/0738727342
Taking Refuge and Dedicating Merit are adapted from Sam Webster.
https://hermetic.com/webster/pagan-dharma2
Some of the pathworking components were inspired by Copenhagen Qabalah, which is back on the Internet after a long absence.
https://qabalah2020.blogspot.com/
I'm sure there are others, that's just off the top of my head.
Mr. Stenwick
Thank you,
Somehow I thought they were from Agrippa's writings.
Have you ever read his material?
If so, what was your opinion?
I thought that I read He gave up Magick and became a lawyer, and defended a woman accused
of witchcraft, by saying that only crazy people practice witchcraft?
Have you ever heard of this story?
Also do you like the Man Myth and Magick Encyclopedias?
What's your opinion?
Thanks J,
jbyers2@tx.rr.com
A lot of it is from Agrippa, but by way of Liber 777. Many of the correspondences and spirit names there are also found in the Three Books of Occult Philosophy. Agrippa, in turn, was pulling from older sources like the Picatrix and medieval grimoires.
I have read the Three Books of Occult Philosophy. It is a good compendium of magical knowledge as it existed in the early sixteenth century, and really the only books of that kind when they were published. The Fourth Book was later and unlikely to have been written by Agrippa, but rather someone who decided to attribute the text anyway.
I've never heard anything about Agrippa giving up magick. If that's true, that tells me he was doing it wrong. The Three Books are more like an encyclopedia than a grimoire, and Agrippa doesn't explain anything in them about his personal practice.
He was a lawyer and defended accused witches, that much is true. He was also a well-known swordsman. Remember that bit in "Princess Bride" where Inigo mentions "studying his Agrippa?" Both Agrippa and one of his sons were swordmasters, and the comment could have alluded to either. He was a man of many talents who did a lot of different things over the course of his life.
I'm not very familiar with the Man Myth and Magick Encyclopedias. Most books of that sort are reasonable overviews, but most also contain some inaccuracies.
I too think correction fluid should not be a problem (at least on paper of which I have experience). However, I was told by others that the talisman's surface needs to be undergo permanent change, a sort of violent change such as surgery scars on the body. For paper, this is most definitely ink but for metal, painting does not cause a permanent change. I should have used a simple engraving tool to scratch the writing on the surface of the metal. At least my friend got his Aries talisman working where he used engraving.
Now though, I am totally convinced that the talisman is not working. Whatever power it was exuding the first 2-3 days is now gone.
You have suggested a turnaround in the past which is to create more talismans of the same power with or without the same spirit to see if the power adds up. I think that's a proper suggestion, but that Aries election is long gone and will not resurface until Mars enters a strong position like a decan, term, or Scorpio.
Also, I'd like to ask about your experience with iron for earth. I want to prove my friend wrong, who claims that iron is not a precious metal and hence doesn't work for anything except Mars.
I have not found that they need to be engraved. Drawing on them with ink of some sort seems to work fine.
It is true that not all my talismans work. Most do, but every so often I get one that just fizzles out for no reason I can easily ascertain. Magick is not nearly as mechanical as stuff in the physical sciences, though I do my best to make my methods repeatable and reasonably reliable. It's definitely unfortunate when you get one of those on a good election. I find it's less likely, but not impossible.
I haven't tried using iron specifically for Earth. It comes out of the ground, so logically I would think you can do it. But my experience with iron as a talisman is all from working with Mars. The way to prove it one way or the other, of course, is to test it yourself. Experimental data is always better than traditional lore.
I will test out iron for elemental Earth and if it works, then for Saturn and his signs. I see no reason why they would fail with that material. Grimoires prescribe iron for nefarious purposes as well.
I would also like to ask you about planetary affiliation with a specific goal. People recommend all 7 planets for one particular goal, linking each planet to its particular influence over that request. So Jupiter, Venus and Sun are not the only planets for gain. Mars, Moon and Saturn offer their help too. What role does Mars offer here? Do you think that it can do anything besides its traditional powers?
Sounds good. Let me know how it goes.
All the planets can do things beyond their traditional powers, so Mars should be no exception.
https://ananael.blogspot.com/2018/02/magical-powers-are-descriptive-not.html
Mars could be will, drive, determination in the context of gain. Or any other property astrologers associate with the planet.
I have done the earth iron spell and I was waiting for the results but two incredibly unfortunate things started happening. Our parked family car got hit by a speeding fool at night the next day, I lost something precious to me. I have yet to divine whether the faulty talisman was the cause but it was enough for me to destroy it. But I made another one recently and the divination seems fine.
Now that the Sun has entered Leo, I would want to focus more on Sun, Leo and fire. There are many powers for the Sun in both KoS and Picatrix combined.
I would like to ask you, out of the 3 which magickal power sets, which do you go for mostly? Elements, planets or signs?
I wish to go for elements so I am not reliant on the other two because I’m getting more and more convinced that elemental magick doesn’t rely on the same rules for astrological elections as planets and signs. For example, the Lunar mansions have to be invoked on the day the Moon enters the mansion, followed by the Moon in the asc or mc without any consideration for the hour because the LMs are not a part of planetary magick; astrological sure, but not planetary. Similarly the elements are not planetary, they just make use of the astrological timing but they are their own separate category. So to me the asc/mc matters more than the Dorotheus hour.
For example, Monday night would be the best time for earth magick, when the Moon enters the asc/mc. Thursday night would be the best time for fire magick when Jupiter enters Asc/Mc etc. I find it practically impossible for the hour to coincidence with the Asc/Mc so for now I’m giving more precedence to the Asc/MC + day just like the LMs. What do you think of this approach?
Also can you guess how many elemental spells are you able to do per month on average? My guess is you do elemental talismans a lot because of their speedy results and near constant availability. However, I’ve been told that the elemental Kings are closest to us and are unable to ‘figure out what we need but can’t say’ like angels. Do you have a warning for that?
I’ve seen people work with the Shem angels to achieve supreme results in just a week. Can that ever happen with zodiacal angels?
Can Cancer’s magnetization be used to undo bad luck and replace it with a magnet of good luck? Specifically the type of luck we want as opposed to ‘Cancer’s’ luck? An example would be nice.
I would have a hard time saying which ones I use the most. It depends on what I want, what is going on in my life, and what the astrological conditions are.
Same is true as far as number of spells on average. It varies. Some months I'll only do one or two, sometimes I do a lot. That depends mostly on what is going on in my life and what I am trying to accomplish.
Yes, zodiac angels can move quickly depending on the astrological conditions. For example, you can look at factors like the speed of the Moon since it is the final dispositor of astrological energy. I will say that in my experience, though, the Shem angels do seem to work faster. My best result with them was something like two days, and I haven't seen anything quite that fast from the general zodiacals. Within a week, sure, but not two days.
Cancer could be used like that. "I call on you to magnetize good fortune to me and expel all bad fortune from my life" or something like that for your charge.
How do you calculate lunar speed? I just go over to Astro-seek website which generates the speed as part of the election automatically for me.
Are you revisiting Shem angel work? I think the reason these guys are reported to work fast is because they might not be zodiacal at all. Their attribution is the planetary decan in the sign of the zodiac. This makes them decanic angels, not zodiacal angels. I'm willing to bet on that.
Nick Farrell seems to think so which is why I think the zodiacal archangel can be used as a word of power to invoke the Shem angel but not vice versa.
Also if you're interested in a more traditional decanic list of angels, you have Matther's derived angels in 777 but the decanic functions are not in GD literature.
Moon in Cancer will be up in a few days. I wish to try that Cancer talisman on brass (also the King Scale color) but your example charge sounds perfect. Not sure how powerful Cancer itself is as a sign because the Moon is regarded as the weakest of all planets.
Considering most of my Picatrix friends don't make lunar talismans because the Moon is always in a square, opposition, combustion, or a negative aspect with other planets, what negative aspects do you ignore in your Cancer elections?
About the elements, between Crowley's GRP, Matther's SRP, Regardie's Watchtower and Dee's Enochian, which seems to be the most effective in your experience?
"I will say that in my experience, though, the Shem angels do seem to work faster. My best result with them was something like two days, and I haven't seen anything quite that fast from the general zodiacals. Within a week, sure, but not two days."
Even a week is fine with the zodiacal angels for me but I have done very few rites of that category. Were the shem angel results similar to that of zodiacal angel results? Or would you say the Shem angels traded power for speed?
I have done a couple operations over the last year or so. Not enough to have a good sample size or draw firm conclusions. One of those operations worked really fast, but the probability I was casting against was hard to calculate, so I can't really do a power versus speed comparison with a single example. I can just say it worked faster than I've seen the sign angels work.
I don't see how decans aren't zodiacal. They are different from signs, though.
The Moon is not always in a negative aspect with other planets. Maybe if you use super-wide orbs, but I never go over 5 degrees myself.
As far as forms - I don't use the SRP because I don't practice Golden Dawn Enochian, so the Enochian attributions are wrong for the way I work with the system. Opening by Watchtower is no better than LBRP/LIRH and takes a lot more time. I use the GRP for elemental rituals and the GRH for planets and signs as laid out in Crowley's Liber O. Not sure what you mean by "Dee Enochian." That isn't remotely the same thing as a ceremonial form.
Astro-seek is good for getting the speed of the Moon. Other desktop software can do it too.
I agree that 2 operations are not enough for a sample size. Would 5-7 operations be a good hit for you to conclude?
I would like to know which sigils you employed for the Shem angels. Did you go by your standard Hebrew name on the planetary Kamea approach, or did you just use one of their own sigils?
In your experience, is Water or Cancer able to shield you from all negative emotions at least for a while until the deadline of your charge? This is the charge I am going for, 'Muriel consecrate this talisman to make me as resilient and indestructible internally as a crab's shell is externally, without negatively impacting my goals or daily responsibilities. Do this for of days from now or whenever I tell you to pause.'
Would this work? Virgo makes you invisible from the outer. Cancer can shield you from the inside. I missed the Moon in Cancer election and I would have to wait for the next month.
Also, can the Hebrew letter associated with the path also serve as an additional godname? So for Earth this is Tau or would you say the letters contain no power and can only serve as another symbol for pathworking?
Indeed 5 sounds like a perfect number to continue working with a set of spirits but how are you going to get past that number? Take a look at the Shem angels and tell me if you find any powers useful than a handful. Everyone uses that one list from Papus that is chockful of Christian bias. Each Shem angel has a function that is very vague. If you are lucky, you may get just 4-5 Shem angels.
Also, what was the reason for eschewing the Shem angel sigils in favor of the Agrippa Kamea sigil? Their available sigils are reported to work well already. Imagine having to draw a 5 lettered Shem angel name of Capricorn on the tiny Saturn kamea.
There was no specific intent behind using the Agrippa sigils, that's just how I did them. I'm sure that the traditional sigils work fine, I just happen to like the Agrippa method. Feel free to use the traditional sigils if you prefer.
You know you can draw your kameas as big as you want, right? The Saturn kamea can be the size of a sheet of paper, which poses no challenge for drawing sigils. I don't usually do them quite that big, but it sounds like yours are significantly smaller if you have trouble drawing on them.
Fasting never did anything for me too. It only took away my energy and focus but offering prayers of psalms and biblical passages does seem to delight them a lot, in my experience. An angel refused alcohol from a practitioner, but they never rejected his prayers.
You can find out about Rankine's experience with that minion on his latest glitch bottle podcast. However, I have to agree that a magician who practices daily will reap the rewards of his practice.
What you have revealed about your daily practice in relation to your magical power is something I have only begun to discover. My chronic constipation of 2 years has disappeared completely since the past 2 weeks and my chronic cold has returned, no doubt because of the daily practice I have kept up since those 2 weeks.
Is your email still operational? I haven't been able to msg since June despite using me new email address. I get a notification that your isp Iphouse rejected my email from being forwarded to their server. I emailed their customer support and their response was that your email address is not even registered in their database.
How do I reach you on email?
Mr. Scott Stenwick,
What is the appropriate alcoholic offering for Mercury, The Moon, and Venus?
Do activities like masturbation and release sap our magickal power?
Regarding my old email, the provider shut down individual email accounts so the iphouse address no longer works. I'm still trying to work out what email I want to use for magical correspondence. I'll keep you all posted once I work that out.
Mercury would be just about anything due to its mutability. Damiana is great for Venus and the Moon, but a lot of other sorts of "spirits" will work. It seems like most alcohol is acceptable for most entities without a lot of additional qualification.
Regarding the idea of sex draining your energy and so forth I have a whole spiel about that. In the Qigong tradition it is taught that sex disperses energy and reduces Qi and degrades health. But over a century of scientific research has not born any actual scientific evidence - despite puritans of all sorts desperately trying to find some.
In practice, I don't find that sex drains my energy in any way. In fact, it can be energizing. Science shows that for men, frequent ejaculation is slightly more healthy than abstinence because it reduces the risk of prostate cancer. The difference is pretty small, but if it really degraded health you would expect the opposite observation.
So what I think is going on is this. Prior to the scientific method, disciplines advanced by a sort of "sifting process" based on observation. Basically students would keep track of what worked and what didn't over time, with no regard to mechanism or underlying principles. This can be good because it allows for unexpected discoveries, but it also allows some inaccurate explanations to endure. There are all kinds of examples of this in alternative medicine - techniques that work, but not for the reasons practitioners claim.
As far as sex and health goes, I think the observation that led to the idea that it drains Qi and degrades health comes from the ancient observation that people who had a lot of sex were more likely to get sick. Having a lot of unprotected sex will eventually make you sick - but from sexually transmitted diseases, not anything to do with energy. The observation isn't wrong, but the rationale is far different from what the lore contends.
Then I think this is the perfect opportunity for me to ask. I suggest creating a Google Classroom group where your students can use their Google accounts to post questions, share experiences and even msg each other without having you needing to approve each and every query and comment. Unlike Iphouse, Google is never going anywhere.
You can try other options like Microsoft Teams but I think Google Classroom is better plus it avoids issues like trolling, harassment and the like.
Classes can be divided by topic and people can upload their own moderation of your ritual structure as part of sharing their experience. Weekly googls forums can be shared, polling for answers to questions and deriving important data regarding topics.
Any Updates?
Can I post Questions? And Get Responses?
The 4 World of Kabbalah have Sephirots in all 4 Realms :Aziluth:God-Name and its specific colour(Personaly i thing it s best to imagine here Archetype Image :Geburah-Crowned King with Sword on Chariot),Briah: Archangel and its colour(Sigil perhaps),Yetzirah:Choir of Angels and it s colour and Assiah :Heavens or Spheres for ali Sephirots and it s images and 4 Minor Arcana association.
Working on one Sephirot in all 4 Realm can also incorporate Archetype Image,Tarot or i guess sigil or appropiate symbol!Now,how to incorporate the 22 Paths and in what line to add them in all 4 Realms?
For example:
Path of Tau:
King Scale: Indigo -God -name :AB(maybe add symbol of Planet Saturn on pale yellow on indigo background)
Queen Scale: Black -Cassiel
Emperor Scale: Blue black -?(Tarot?)-
What to vibrate that corespond to Yetzirah ?
Empress Scale: Black rayed blue-?
Sephirots are clear but Paths not so much to me with precise information.I see Liber 777 but i just don t know how to add every thing in its place .
Yes, you can post questions here and get responses. But lately it's been taking me a few days to get to them. Posts are moderated so I have to approve them before they show up on the site because we get tons of spam posts otherwise.
I haven't put together something this comprehensive for all the paths, and 777 is not as detailed regarding this as one might like.
For godnames - the Agrippa planetary godnames (like AB) work for the planetary paths. Zodiacal paths use the permutation of tetragrammaton for the signs. Elemental paths use the element godname (as in the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram).
Angel names are straightforward. You have the archangels named in the LRP for the elements, planetary angels (like Cassiel) for the planets, and the zodiacal angel names for the zodiac. These can be found in the "Geomantic Intelligences" column of Liber 777, which is not very intuitively named.
If I were going to use angel choir names with the path, I would associate those back to the sephiroth. All zodiacal signs are related sephirothically to Chockmah, so that would be the choir to use for all twelve. The elements are sephirothically associated to Malkuth, so that would be the choir to use for all the elements. Then the planetary paths would be associated with the choir related to the corresponding sephira.
Finally, the Heaven of Assiah name for each path would correspond to Assiah. The Tarot attributions are very straightforward, since the paths simply map to the Major Arcana.
Scott, that is why I suggested Google Classroom. To overcome spam and to provide a better environment for your students.
Scott, what do you think of using some magickal power to uncover which tools we need to use that will be best for us? Taking programming as an example, Angular or React? Php Laravel or C# dotnet? F# or Go? MySQL or Postgress? Windows or Linux? AWS or Azure? Enterprise software development or small-scale development? Opinionated vs unopinionated? It just doesn't stop. Thing is I need to pose these unanswerable questions to the angels who know more about them far better than I could.
You may of course suggest Raphael as the overall spirit for all these questions but how would you go about it? Would you create a talisman or would you petition him? Would you charge him to grant you wisdom regarding these tools or would you charge him to grant the mental clarity to learn the right tools as best as possible? I think a talisman would be better since it could be given new instructions in light of better knowledge and experience.
I don't think would be a career helper talisman, though Agrippa and Picatrix magicians would look at it that way as they prefer talismans to last a lifetime. This would be a simple wisdom talisman as wisdom require these tools is all we want from Mercury currently. Saturn would be the one to cut away the difficulties with his own shenanigans and make use of Mercury's wisdom. Two brass talismans from Saturn and Mercury will be enough imo.
I prefer Angular btw because I don't want to learn: React, Vue, Next, Nest to signify to the employer that I am to more roles than I am capable of, even though Laravel works better with Vue because of their community experts. I prefer solid skills in a few technologies over micro skills in a large number of intricate technologies.
I also would like to protect myself from hype trains. I had a habit until recently of jumping from one tool to the next if youtubers convinced me that they were the best for me. Which power would I approach to catch this gullibility as it's rising?
I think a talisman for insight into what will work best for you sounds like a good approach. I'm not sure that I see much difference between wisdom and mental clarity in this regard - they basically are alluding to the same thing. Saturn should work to eliminate obstacles and Mercury should help with the technology itself.
Since tools do change over time, I don't see any reason why these couldn't be permanent talismans. If they always give you insight into the best tools and methods, that could help prevent you from chasing "hype trains" that won't work out for you in addition to helping you decide what you want to do now.
Saturn will work to eliminate obstacles, and Mercury will work with the cognitive overhead involved, but what exactly will bring about the insight I need. My problem is, 'I don't know what I don't know and that is all I know'. You may say 'Jupiter' but Jupitar is not known for wisdom, Saturn is. Sun, Mercury and Moon are known for road opening and Jupiter is used for expansion or transformation (Sagittarius) but if I use too many planets, I might not know exactly which is working or not. It is no coincidence.
One potential solution to this could be servitors as they are made for granular control over the situation where spirits might be inefficient but I'm open to your opinion on how you go about selecting the appropriate powers when you have little clue.
No, I would not say Jupiter for that, actually. And you do want to be careful mixing in too many planets. Not all of them get along and that can mess up the spell.
If you really are not sure, do some sort of divination and see what that suggests. I generally use Tarot but other methods will work if you know those better and are more familiar with using them.
I don't see a lot of difference in terms of function between servitors and talismans empowered by spirits. I would think both of those approaches would work the same.
I was hoping the servitor itself might serve the divinatory purposes as opposed to throwing cards or dice that don't chain you to impersonal rules and regulations of a system. Surprisingly people make servitors for more reasons than they invoke planets. Need help with finding a vendor for your car's specific part in your city? Someone made a servitor for that instead of invoking Mercury and waiting for how long. Need help with jailing an abusive ex? Someone told me they made a servitor for that, and it worked. Need help with finding tarot cards in your city? I used someone's servitor for that.
There are more use cases for servitors than I or anybody can find for planets. The planets only represent classical occult powers. Jason Miller is doing a similar sort of thing with his Hekate-for-everything system.
So if servitors can be used for anything you invoke the planets for, what do you make servitors for?
The classical powers for the planets (and signs, and elements) are descriptive, not prescriptive. You can do elemental, planetary, and zodiacal operations for any quality that corresponds to the planet and sign. You are not stuck with a set list.
I've mentioned this in every planetary, zodiacal, and elemental operation post, and written about it specifically here:
https://ananael.blogspot.com/2018/02/magical-powers-are-descriptive-not.html
So no, you are NOT stuck with a set list for planetary powers (or elemental powers, or zodiacal powers).
As I see it, the only difference between the way chaos magicians create servitors and the way I do planetary talismans is that (1) talisman operations link to objects, by definition. Chaos magicians sometimes link their servitors to objects but not always, and (2) I call on spirits to join me in empowering the talisman, which results in a magical effect that combines my personal power with that of the spirit. As I understand it, chaos magicians create servitors using only their personal power.
Because of that, I don't really do chaos magic style servitors. The powers are not as restrictive as you are suggesting here, and adding the power of a spirit or spirits makes the final effect stronger.
And what do you mean, invoking Mercury and waiting? Surely you deliver a specific charge for the thing you want rather than just invoking energy and waiting for something to happen... right?
And what do you when you can't find a power that relates to your problem? Would that not stop you from progressing with the magick? Chaos magicians make servitors using just a fraction of their attention each day over a week and set food sources for the servitor to feed itself as it grows stronger as in more intelligent over time, consequently delivering faster and more efficient results.
In contrast, when does a talisman ever grow in power? Either it works, or it completely fails. If the only reason to use a talisman over a servitor is the spirit's power then yes a talisman is a stronger use case.
As for Mercury in that example, you would invoke Mercury, give the charge and since you can't do anything in such a situation, you would just wait until something happens.
I have never not been able to find a power that relates to what I want to do. For examples, take a look at a few of the zodiac powers specifically.
Cancer = Enchantment. Can call anything into your life.
Sagittarius = Transmutation. Can transform anything into any other thing.
Libra = Works of justice and equilibrium. Right any unfair situation, and/or balance the outcome of anything.
They also all run on sphere of influence, so they can cause those things and also prevent them.
As for planets, I guarantee that if you look into everything attributed to the planets by astrologers they cover every area of life. Part of the discipline of astrology is taking everything in life and dividing it that way.
Talismans grow in power if you charge them to consume energy and grow themselves in power. They work just like servitors in that regard. You charge them to feed off whatever source of energy you want them to use and grow accordingly. I realize that a lot of people don't teach that, but I've found that it works. Really, a talisman with a complex charge is just like a servitor anchored to an object created with the help of a spirit.
Oh, I misunderstood that with Mercury. Still, how is a servitor different, then? You create it and send it out to accomplish a task. That doesn't strike me as any different than setting a charge in motion, especially a complex one.
Once a charge is set, it is set. The talisman or the petition can not be commanded to change its function. In contrast, a servitor can be repurposed effectively as long as it is still in its learning phase.
I have never heard of talismans having the ability to grow in power as their power is based on the moment of their birthchart which sets them in motion unless of course you believe in a different model.
As for zodiac signs offering a few more options, they are at the mercy of the planets' astrological conditions. Moon offers only two chances of lunar and Cancer magick per month - when it's in Taurus or Cancer. The rest of the planets and their signs become totally unusable when they enter essential and accidental debilities which for Saturn and Jupiter last for 2-3 years. Still there are commercial magicians like Aaron Leitch who offer Jupiter novena and chime candle services in Jupiter's current year long debility
which he justifies by claiming that he is not doing planetary magick for his clients, like talismans or invocations but petitions to the Jupiter spirits on his altar and continues to get new orders which tells me that they are working even though astrologically they should not. Are you using the same concept to justify say Jupiter planetary and zodiacal magick?
Also, there is a matter of spiritual authority; the authority by which the magician calls the spirits. You have it but others like myself don't. Servitors are made by you so you are their God. How does one gain spiritual authority to call these stubborn angels?
That is sort of true about repurposing servitors, but when you change the charge they have to start over on whatever you want them to do. So it is usually more advisable to make a new one anyway.
It's not about what I believe, it's what I've been able to verify experimentally. Talismans can be programmed to "feed" on different energy sources as part of the charge, and they can become more powerful in that way over time. They start with their birth chart, true, just like we do. But they can also grow. I've seen it happen quite a few times now - but you need to program it into their design or they will stay fixed.
Where do you get the idea that you can, for example, only do lunar magick twice a month? It's more like you just want to avoid debility and fall, not do magick in rulership only. You can get excellent results with all the planets as long as they are not debilitated, and even then debilities don't cancel out magick that you work, they just weaken it. Your spell won't be as powerful, but that doesn't mean it won't work.
I don't have a very high opinion of Leitch in general, and no, I don't think that's the reason. The reason is that even during debilities the magick still works. He's noticing that it works, and trying to reconcile his results with the (stupid) idea that debilities completely shut down magick - when they actually don't.
If you aren't getting the spiritual authority to call spirits, there isn't a lot of advice I can give you. I went through the HGA work in the Thelemic system, so I know that way works. Doing a bunch of Bornless Ritual invocations over a period of time probably works too, since that's not much difference than our Thelemic Liber Samekh. Other methods fall outside my personal experience.
Don't get me wrong, if servitors are what work for you, go for it. I'm not trying to discourage you in any way, just point out some assumptions that I don't believe are correct. The first rule of magick with me is always if it works, it works.
I have also seen people make multiple servitors for an entire issue similar to assigning different parts of the problem to different planetary spirits. A servitor is also not bound like a talisman and hence has infinite possibilities though I'm not sure how powerful it will be compared to scale the zodiacal angels.
So when you program the talisman to feed on different energy sources, is it self reliant or do you have to feed it yourself? Also when does the talisman peak in power?
I got this idea of Lunar magick from Picatrix people who have a few but strict rules to observe for lunar talismans and petitions. Just the slightest error in the election ruins their whole operation which severely limits their lunar operations to a handful per year but I'm speaking on their behalf. I have only done one lunar petition so far according to your/my ritual template and it failed completely so the motivation to continue with lunar magic was never there. I have since done 2 or 3 cancer talismans which failed too, two of which were made for other people. My inexperienced self, had no option but to blame the elections even though they were excellent, or the angels themselves rejecting the invocation. This was all back in 2023 and early 2024 when I experimented most with talismans. I didn't make any since, as I am currently evaluating my decision to quit spirit magick, hence the experimentation of servitors. Sachiel was the only one who didn't fail me but even he now fails completely. So, I'm not sure in what capacity I'm supposed to engage with spirits now - magick or otherwise - as failure is I've had. I still have yet to try Saint magick like the Catholics though. They do prayers to saints, meaning magick without expectations.
But now that you have shared that there are more lunar operations available than just two per month, does this apply to Cancer as well?
Regarding Leitch, it's his personal preference to not do planetary magick when the planet is in debilities. He won't even admit that there are non-astrological angels as well who exist above the realm of astrology such as Raziel, Metatron and the sephirotic archangels. To him all angels are astrological. However, he does agree that when a KoS pentacle or a traditional talisman is made and consecrated properly, it will continue to function through all kinds of astrological transits.
We can discuss authority a bit more. Can you remember having done Liber Samekh operation before or after when you started doing these rituals? Were the results still being delivered before that point? Can you remember whether K&C with the HGA improved your results or brought the highly elusive zodiacal angels responsive to your invocations?
Can you tell why the Stele of Jeu (Bornless invocation) works?
Can you actually believe that there are entire groups on facebook and reddit that exist just for THANKING St Expedite for his works? Impossible! This one saint is doing more for people than the entire 7 planetary angels have done for people their entire lives and his story is fascinating. Just go and read those testimonies and you will feel the truth behind them. More than million success stories have been reported with him. He is the most popular saint for causing general miracles.
I asked a few folks whether it would be possible to make talismans with saints (something that is never done with saints) and they agreed as a talisman is just a magical item empowered by a spirit though it would be great to know if saints are open to such requests. Do you think he will consecrate a talisman for me considering he's a saint of 'urgent causes'? And urgent (immediate) and talisman (long-term) don't jive together.
You can do that with talismans too, create multiple talismans for different parts of the same operation. Works fine. I'm not sure what you mean about servitors being unbound. In my experience operations almost always work better when bound to a physical object - or are you talking about something else?
Usually I charge them to feed off some existing source of energy so I don't have to deliberately feed them myself.
I have never found magick to be anywhere as touchy as the Picatrix folks say it is. It's true that the better election I can get, the more powerful the spell is, but I don't see things like negative effects from casting on bad elections. At worst, the spell just doesn't do anything. You can do spells with mediocre elections and still get results - or at least I've been able to do that on many occasions. And the election is not just the dignity or debility of the planet, it's the entire chart that has to be analyzed. So yes, you have many more than a couple options per month or per year for all this stuff.
It definitely seemed like K&C made everything work better. But I was still able to get practical results before I did it. They just weren't as intense or effective.
I don't think anybody know exactly why the Stele of Jeu works the way it does. I could probably write a whole book on it and it would be mostly speculation. I have some ideas about it, but I'm not sure if they are particularly meaningful to anyone but me.
You have to be careful with testamonials. They are often cherry-picked or outright fake. A lot of testimonials does tell you that a lot of people are working with a particular entity, but if all you see is testamonials of success, you still have to no idea what the ratio of success to failure is. That's the key piece of information that you need to make a determination, and it's hard to come by.
I would agree that you should be able to make a talisman calling on a saint. Spirits are spirits in my book, so I would think something like that should work. And you can make a talisman that speeds up results or something like that without it contradicting the nature of talismans. Those are completely separate things, unrelated to each other.
Yes. I know you told me before about talismans being able to smoothly destroy different aspects of the problem, even the same spirit is able to empower multiple talismans, multiplying the overall power. However, does this also apply to paper talismans? We don't have authentic stones here in my country. All are fake stones from China and I have not been able to get metal talismans to work, yet.
The reason I chose the word destroy is because I don't believe spirits take the least resistant path. They just find it incredibly difficult to fulfill our charge for us. This is why when spells fail, it's not because it was weak, or the probability was too little but because the spirit worked overnight and was met with failure. Trump didn't lose this year's election, right? Even Enochian failed.
I have met a few picatrix mages who have shared problems with their magick after disregarding the rules in the book. Note how they are the least approving of paper talismans.
None of these have a daily golden dawn practice but they have something like planetary charity. Their results have matured each year over which just proves their warnings are to considered.
Regarding Cancer elections, have you found that its magnetization power to draw something that is traditionally associated with a specific planet, performed equally well as the planet? Like say Cancer's magnetization for love vs Venus love spell for love (bad example, you're married), or against Saturn's 'keep away' spell or Moon's door opening spell? I'm having a hard time believing this tiny angel Muriel can do all of that herself.
With St Expedite testimonials, the groups are for successful stories so failures are not reported. The posts appear over and over again with no end in sight from everyone between novices and experts. From students thanking him for exam success to apartment renters thanking him for a new home. Some invoke him with other saints like St Joseph (jesus' father) while others do not. What I see repeatedly with him is that he requires very little for himself and like Cancer, has general powers. He can be asked for anything as long as it's for an urgent cause. There are a few angels with that power in the Shem angel category. Also the reason we see so many testimonials of him is because he is not a 'magick specific' saint like Cyprian. His cause of popularity is his association as a Catholic Saint who appeared miraculously as a statue to a group of nuns in France who experimented by praying for his intercession and they were answered immediately.
With Expedite, people are warned prior to seeking his intercession to offer him whatever they promised him otherwise he will take away what he is asked to give. The posts reveal that they follow through with this promise.
Notice how he is simultaneously the Saint against procrastination also as procrastination is the opposite of action needed to cause the change you want from him. I saw one magician who asked a question regarding his tarot divination on his operation with St Expedite and a few days later he got the result after applying the advice of the cards; which was to take action.
I also have something new from a new picatrix person I met. He was unemployed for 4 months, he got a job after he did a bunch of Mercurial and Solar picatrix rituals but he does not know which ritual got worked for him. How is that possible? How can you not know which power worked for you? Doesn't this mean that everyone is lying to themself when they claim such and such power worked for them when they don't even have the proof?
The difference with paper talismans is that they are not as durable or last as long. Otherwise they work like stones or metals.
In my experience magick always takes the least resistant path to accomplishing the charge, whether you call on spirits or not. I'm nit exactlt sure what you mean here. In politics, you have to cast against everybody else casting for the other outcome and it's always difficult. Also, magick isn't a deterministic force like kinetic energy - it's not going to work all of the time because probability is inherently unpredictable.
I find that Cancer can work that way, yes. If you don't believe me, all I can tell you is try it and see.
I haven't worked at all with St. Expedite or even read that much about the practice online. So I can't share any personal insights there. I just generally think you should be able get a saint to empower a talisman - but the practice could very well be more involved than that.
If I do five different talismans to get a job I can't necessarily tell you "which one" did. The right answer is probably that they all had a hand in it. Not being able to name one out of the five doesn't mean I'm lying about what I did. That seems to be a pretty extreme takeaway.
What if you made the 5 job talismans from Jupiter alone? The combined power from those talismans will attack the unemployment like a tsunami and there would be no doubts. It wouldn't matter if only 3 of the 5 worked and the other two died, the planet would still be Jupiter. I mean this is the only way to draw data.
The problem is with combining different powers together which makes it difficult to ascertain.
Yes, 5 talismans like that would be very effective. I personally am good at job spells and currently have two running, which seems to be quite sufficient at this time (I am employed, but I keep job talismans running to keep me employed in harmony with my will).
I do think that if you have multiple operations running, they all are going to have some effect on the overall probability matrix and I'm not sure how useful it is to try and ascribe the entire effect to one or the other. That's really not how superimposed probabilities work. Everything plays a part.
Have you been able to determine if using two Cancer talismans through the same or separate operations has proven to overcome the slow zodiacal output of results? Magick is done for immediate or conveniently paced results. I was thinking that more talismans for the same thing would not only increase the power but also the speed of the results as the spirit now has two passages (talismans) available to channel its power through.
I have not tried that specific method, but what you are suggesting makes sense. I would think multiple zodiacal talismans could increase the speed as well as the overall power of an operation.
You have made multiple single planet talismans for the same goal before, such as the two Jupiter job talismans in operation, did you notice the increase in the speed there? Could we be mistaking the rise in power for rise in speed?
Also our conversations have got me interested in trying out this multiple talisman theory with Sagittarius, where Jupiter just happens to be in retrograde. I know you have shared that you have never found a planet being in retrograde (Rx) to be a problem. So, let's say the chart victor falls on a Sunday with or without a Jupiter hour this Rx season. Would you invoke Adnakhiel and have him empower 2-3 talismans using that election to transform something or - because of the rx and detriment Jupiter - would you wait until it passes out of rx and we just have a standard detriment Jupiter? We have to make things as easy as possible for Adnakhiel in this example, so what will we do?
Jupiter stuff does work fast with two talismans. But I do not think it is a case of mistaking speed for power, since both of those factors work together. Again, it cannot just be reduced to one or the other. Magick is more holistic than that.
I have not had issues with planets in retrograde when the chart victor is right and the Moon's final aspect is good. So I would go ahead with the operation regardless of retrograde.
One important point - for talismans to combine energies, you need to create each talisman in its own separate ritual. Otherwise the power of the operation gets divided between them and you do not get much of an advantage. The two Jupiter talismans I am talking about were empowered in separate rituals, not together in one operation.
So to ensure my talismans are being consecrated properly, I have to make 5-8 talismans of the same power until the law of diminishing returns applies.
What you say sounds logical, because they are given the same charge from the same angel. Have you tried setting in the charge the condition to allow either talisman to take the lead based on what the angel perceives to be more performant? There are two spiritual creatures inside the two talismans, so I just think they should collaborate instead of compete if it makes sense.
So this would like 5-8 Jupiter separate talismans until a person gets their job and the person can also involve other planetary talismans.
I also wish to know how much of a time-limit do you give your zodiacal talismans? These are the trickiest of talismans I've found and making them on paper was the dumbest mistake of mine.
I do not construct my charges for talismans exactly like that, but I do always charge talismans to never interfere with each other and always cooperate in producing the best outcome. That is necessary, however you want to do it, because without such a statement there are many ways in which the talismans may not work together well.
I find a month or so is usually good. That's a full lunar cycle, which gives the Moon a chance to transmit as much zodiacal energy as it can. Even when working with signs, the Moon is final dispositor of the energy. That's why the Moon's final aspect is an important element of electional timing.
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