Magical Instruction

If you are a beginning student wondering where to start learning magick, or a more advanced practitioner looking to make your magick more effective, Augoeides is the place for you. Over the years I have published all sorts of material that at one time could only be found within the confines of lodges and secret magical orders. If you have questions, post them in the comments. I always try and do my best to answer them, and I always will.

Personal Instruction

The magick class that I currently run is the Ritual Workshop event at Leaping Laughter OTO, the Minneapolis local body of Ordo Templi Orientis. We meet every Tuesday evening at 7:30 PM at our dedicated temple space. It is located at:

3107 California Street NE
 Minneapolis, MN 55418


This is a public event and all who can attend are welcome. You do not need to be an OTO initiate to attend. The classes are free, but we suggest a $5 donation to help cover temple expenses. Also, keep in mind that we follow a loose version of the Fight Club rule - if you show up, you have to do a ritual. But it can be any ritual from any tradition, as simple as you like, and if you don't know any rituals yet we'll talk you through performing something basic like the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram.

One Tuesday per month we hold our Via Solis Zodiacal Elixir Rites, which are announced here on Augoeides along with the ritual scripts on the preceding Mondays. These are also open to all who can attend, and the same suggested donation applies. But taking part in one of these group rituals counts as doing a ritual, so you won't have to do anything else.

In April of 2018 I participated in a series of online Enochian classes organized by Jason Augustus Newcomb. That series of Enochian Master Classes is now available and you can sign up here. Click here for a coupon code that will give you half off the registration price.

I also am considering doing more online classes at some point in the future, and will announce those here far enough in advance that everyone will have a chance to sign up. In the meantime, the following links organize the material I have posted here into what I hope is a coherent overall framework for study.

Social Media

I am pretty active on the Ceremonial Magick School Facebook group. You can send a request to join and as long as you give reasonable answers to a couple of questions, and you should be approved. Please make sure that you answer the questions - those are there to make sure that we're adding actual human beings and not bots or something in disguise.

Also, feel free to send me a friend request on Facebook. My profile is here, and once we are friends you should get updates from this blog and my author blog in your news feed. I rarely post anything that personal on Facebook, since I use it to promote my books and these websites, so you shouldn't run into anything more controversial than what I post here on Augoeides.

Professional Spellcasting

As I mention in the FAQ, I'm not in the professional spellcasting business and don't do magical operations for clients. Working with clients requires a completely different temple setup and so forth than what I use for my personal work. That may change at some point in the future, but for now if you have questions about how to perform one of the operations I describe here, feel free to email me at scottm@iphouse.com or send me a message on Facebook (once we're friends). I always try to do my best to answer questions of that nature, and I think once you overcome the initial resistance to casting a spell you might very well get better results casting for yourself than you would from any professional for whom said operation is basically just a job.

What Is Magick?

This is one of the most fundamental questions students ask. What is magick, and how does it work? While magick is a highly individual practice, there are some commonalities between schools, methods, and practitioners. My background is in the Thelemic school of modern ceremonial magick and the Hermetic tradition of the European Renaissance, particularly the works of Henry Cornelius Agrippa and John Dee. It was my interest in Dee's work that first prompted me to write the books that would eventually be published as my Mastering Enochian Magick Series.

Building a working model of magick is crucial for working out how to best accomplish various goals, set accurate expectations for the work, and "debug" your procedures when you run into problems. While this does constitute theory, it should be pointed out that an effective magical model should make testable predictions and conform to the scientific method as closely as possible. I say "as possible" because one of the key components of magick is consciousness, which we have yet figured out a way to measure accurately. This prevents "The method of Science" from being employed in its strictest sense, but at the same time it is an ideal for which I believe all magicians should strive.

This first series of articles covers various thoughts related to my model of magick an how it compares to others out there that are currently in use. While reading through it is not strictly necessary, I highly recommend it. What I do not recommend is waiting until you feel like you understand it all completely before you start doing any work. You should start learning to do the rituals I present here and practice them as soon as you can manage. You're not likely to hurt yourself if you do something wrong and there's no substitute for experience.

Regarding Magical Models
I generally think that the "quantum information model" that I propose in this series is currently the best model of magick that we have. Note that I specific "quantum" not because I see it as a synonym for "awesome" like some New Agers, but rather because it is vitally important to draw a distinction between quantum information, data, and language. The last two have nothing to do with quantum information. The number of facts we amass or web pages we create have no relation to the structure of the universe. And the fundamental weakness of the original "information model" of magick was that it confused semiotics and physics.

Basic Practices

This article from 2006, this one from 2008, and this one from 2016 give an overview of what I recommend as an effective daily magical practice. Every magician should develop a sequence of basic rituals that he or she performs at least once per day, generally in the morning after waking up or at night before going to sleep. Which you prefer depends a lot on your personal circadian clock - I'm a total night owl and can't get anything done in the morning, so I do my practices at night before I go to sleep. Either should prove effective.

The Basic Rituals
  • The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram. This simple rite is generally considered the most basic modern ceremonial ritual, and one of the first bits of magick that modern magicians learn. It is a microcosmic banishing and invoking ritual. That is, it works on your personal consciousness. The banishing form clears, stabilizes, and cuts away connections that may be influencing you. The invoking form energizes and empowers your sphere of consciousness. Note that this ritual does not "clear a space" beyond your body's natural aura, though some magicians incorrectly use it that way.
  • The Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram. This ritual is the macrocosmic counterpart to the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram. That is, it works on space in the external world beyond your personal consciousness. The banishing form of this ritual is commonly taught as a daily practice, but I strongly recommend against it. You don't want to shut down or send the forces of nature away. To do effective practical magick, you want to connect with and manipulate them - which is what the invoking form of this ritual does. The banishing form can be used to clear a space, but when using in conjunction with the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram it shuts down everything. That can include your own currently running operations.
  • The Middle Pillar Ritual. I don't teach most of Israel Regardie's methods, but the Middle Pillar Ritual is an exception. It brings energy work and identification with the divine into daily practice.
  • Meditation should also be taken up by aspiring students of magick. There are a lot of variations on meditation practice out there, but most of them produce similar effects. The method here is based on the simple non-sectarian "Mindfulness Meditation" method. You should try to meditate for about twenty minutes a day, which is entirely sufficient for magical work.
  • The Greater Ritual of the Pentagram. This is mostly an overview of how I do the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram, with some light commentary. I wrote it up because there is a lot of conflicting information online about how to do the Greater Pentagram along with other rituals like the "Supreme Pentagram" (which I don't use or teach) and so forth. This ritual can be used as part of a daily practice, especially as a preliminary to more involved HGA work. It also is used for practical elemental work.
  • The Greater Ritual of the Hexagram. This is my overview of the Greater Ritual of the Hexagram, which is used to tune your magical space for working with planets and zodiac signs just like the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram tunes your space for working with elements.
As a beginning student of magick, think of learning these rituals and techniques as your "one job" until you have them committed to memory and are doing them every day. They form the foundation of everything that is to come, including all of my practical magick methods. The whole sequence including a twenty minute meditation session can be done in less that a half hour, and that is really a small time commitment to make in order to pursue the path of magick and mysticism.

Commentaries on the Basic Rituals

The following articles go over the basic rituals that I have written up commentaries on so far, including extended commentaries and experimental speculation related to them. As I do more of these, I will add them to this list.
  • Lesser Versus Greater Pentagrams. This article was written to dispel a particularly pernicious myth about the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram. Even though the pentagrams you are tracing are drawn in the same direction as Earth pentagrams, they are not exclusive to the element of Earth.
  • Hacking the Elemental Hexagrams. This article digs into a speculative method for using the elemental hexagrams from the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram to work with the four Qabalistic worlds. It was written in part as a response to what I consider the dubious practice of doing "Lesser Hexagrams of the Planets." "Lesser" rituals are general and "Greater" rituals are specific. Neither is a "better" or "worse" version of the other - they serve entirely different functions.
  • The Operant Field. This is one of the ideas that started it all, and my own small contribution to modern magick theory. Understanding the microcosmic and macrocosmic natures of the Lesser Pentagram and Lesser Hexagram points to more effective ways to work with these rituals, both in terms of daily practice and larger ceremonial operations. Try it out - you'll be surprised how much better this small change makes everything work.
  • Microcosmic Versus Macrocosmic Rituals. This is a longer and more detailed article discussing the operant field as defined in the preceding article, how Lesser rituals are general and Greater rituals are specific, and how to get at the microcosmic and macrocosmic aspects of the various magical forces.
  • Goetic Circles and Operant Fields. This article looks at some overlap between the operant field model and the magick circle found in a late grimoire, the Lemegeton or Lesser Key of Solomon.
  • Wrapping Up The "Hexagram Controversy". This article discusses the reaction of the online magical community towards the operant field model, and ends with a simple challenge: try it. If you try out the operant field method and it doesn't improve your results, by all means don't keep using it. At the same time, many magicians who have tried it report that their results are better overall, happen faster, and are stronger and more stable when they use it.
  • Thoughts on the Star Ruby. This article is my explanation of Aleister Crowley's "new and more elaborate version of the Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram." This ritual can be used to open an operant field in conjunction with the Star Sapphire, just as the Lesser Banishing Ritual can do the same in conjunction with the Lesser Invoking Ritual of the Hexagram.
  • An Analysis of the Star Sapphire. This article is a comprehensive overview of my thoughts on the Star Sapphire, Aleister Crowley's "improved ritual of the hexagram." The Star Sapphire behaves a lot like a souped-up version of the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram, and should be used in conjunction with the Star Ruby, Crowley's "improved ritual of the pentagram."
  • Regarding Devotional Work. This article summarizes some devotional methods for use by magicians, particularly those found in Aleister Crowley's Liber Astarte vel Berylli. Devotional rituals that you find inspirational and resonant with your will can be an important addition to your practice.
  • Thoughts on the Rose Cross Ritual. I do not personally use the Golden Dawn Rose Cross Ritual, but I did some experiments with it back in the day and some readers have asked about my take on it. In theory, the ritual works to smooth out and balance magical forces and fields, but so far I have not been able to figure out anything practical to do with it that I would be able to formally test. The idea that it "confers invisibility" does not seem to stand up to strict scrutiny, even though a lot of people apparently believe it.
And I'm sure that there are more to come. The idea is to post all of the relevant articles here so they are all in one place, and you don't have to manually search Augoeides for each one. If you do come across an article I've overlooked that you think belongs here, let me know.

Original Basic Rituals

These are some alternatives that I have written to the standard basic ritual forms discussed above. They can make for interesting experimentation, but I recommend you learn the standard versions first before moving on to any of these.
  • Revising the Keyword Analysis. This article covers a revised version of the Keyword Analysis from the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram that my magical working group developed.
  • Comselh Ananael Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram. This is the version of the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram used by my magical working group, including the changes explained in the article on Hacking the Keyword Analysis.
  • The Field Ritual. This is an experimental ritual developed at the Leaping Laughter Ritual Workshop that combines the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram and Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram along operant field lines.

Practical Magick

Once my students have a daily practice in place, I start them off with practical magick. That's one of the big differences between me and most other teachers. My main goal is to get you doing the work as quickly as possible, and getting good results as quickly as possible.

Most of the magical orders of the past have initiatory systems that you must go through before you are given any practical material at all. Further down this page I have my Path of Initiation too, but as I see it you can be doing practical work right away. While you want to cultivate illumination and realization as you work, odds at that there are a lot of issues in your life that can get in the way. So start off by eliminating or at least mediating those.

The Magical Powers listed after the various attributes are Descriptive, Not Prescriptive. The powers listed here are from Aleister Crowley's Liber 777, but they should not be treated as all you can do with any of these magical forces. For example, in many cases elemental magick can be used to accomplish similar goals to planetary magick. Earth can correspond to wealth and material prosperity, Water can correspond to love and relationships, Air can correspond to healing, and Fire can correspond to cursing and protection from curses. These are all in addition to their listed powers.

The Elemental Work
  • Earth. Alchemy, Geomancy, Making of Pantacles; Travels on the Astral Plane.
  • Water. The Great Work, Talismans, Crystal-gazing, etc.
  • Air. Divination.
  • Fire. Evocation, Pyromancy.
The Planetary Work
  • Saturn. Works of Malediction and Death.
  • Jupiter. Power of Acquiring Political and other Ascendency.
  • Mars. Works of Wrath and Vengeance.
  • Sun. The Red Tincture, Power of Acquiring Wealth.
  • Venus. Love-philtres.
  • Mercury. Miracles of Healing, Gift of Tongues, Knowledge of Sciences.
  • Moon. The White Tincture, Clairvoyance, Divination by Dreams.
  • The Epilogue covers both the Planetary and Elemental Work series of articles, and addresses some of the questions that came up while I was posting the series.
The Zodiacal Work
  • Aries. Power of Consecrating Things.
  • Taurus. The Secret of Physical Strength.
  • Gemini. Power of being in two or more places at one time, and of Prophecy.
  • Cancer. Power of Casting Enchantments.
  • Leo. Power of Training Wild Beasts.
  • Virgo. Invisibility, Parthenogenesis, Initiation.
  • Libra. Works of Justice and Equilibrium.
  • Scorpio. Necromancy.
  • Sagittarius. Transmutations; Vision of Universal Peacock.
  • Capricorn. The Witches’ Sabbath so-called, the Evil Eye.
  • Aquarius. Astrology.
  • Pisces. Bewitchments, Casting Illusions.
These basic magical powers are sufficient for practically any practical operation. They were all developed based on my Comselh Ananael Ritual Template which works or everything. If you would like to dig deeper into how the symbolism works, you can take a look at my article on Qabalistic Ritual Construction and this addendum to it regarding The Circle and Sigils.

The Path of Initiation

This series of articles is based on the published initiatory structure of Aleister Crowley's A.'.A.'. as found in One Star in Sight.

To be clear, I am an OTO initiate but not a member of any of the current A.'.A.'. organizations, and the rituals here were developed by Comselh Ananael, my magical working group. I offer none of my own opinions here regarding any of the A.'.A.'. teachers who have publicly identified themselves as such, and I expect that what they teach their students differs substantially from what is presented here. Nonetheless, we found this approach to be quite effective, and I think you will too.

If you don't have a daily magical practice, you will want to have that established before starting any of these rites. Refer back to my articles in the Basic Practices section for what that should look like. You should keep this practice up basically forever, or at least for the rest of your life.
This article on Improving Solve et Coagula explains why I work the elemental initiations in the order that I do, based on research done by my magical working group. Going in "density order" rather than "reverse YHVH" order seems to lead to a more balanced and stable manifestation of the elements within the student's sphere of consciousness.
The Initiation of Spirit binds the four classical elements and sephiroth from Malkuth through Netzach together. Then, the Holy Guardian Angel Invocation establishes the Knowledge and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel (K&C for short). The ritual here is based on Aleister Crowley's Liber Samekh, with some additions and modifications of my own. Once K&C is established, the student can move on to the next sephira.

Note that it generally takes at least six months or so of practicing the Holy Guardian Angel Invocation ritual daily in order to obtain and stabilize K&C, so it is a substantial undertaking. More traditional grimoire magicians can go back to the source and work the full Abramelin operation on which Liber Samekh is based, but bear in mind that may take even longer. One version of the Abramelin runs for six months, but the other runs for a full eighteen.
Crossing the Abyss is Crowley's terminology for the magical initiation that raises the consciousness of the magician into the supernal realm represented by the first three sephiroth. Once the Abyss has been successfully crossed, the magician can move on to the next sephira.
According to Crowley, once the magician has obtained initiation into Chockmah, he or she speaks a Word, or Logos. This utterance permeates the universe and gives rise to a new spiritual current, or a new manifestation of an existing one. This concept is tied into the zodiacal model of the Aeons, in which the procession of the Earth's axis results in a new sign of the zodiac coming to prominence about every 2000-some years, and the nature of that sign is said to guide human spirituality during the period that it rules over.
The Conclusion consists of my final thoughts on this series, and some of the questions that came up while I was posting these articles.

649 comments:

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Scott Stenwick said...

Unfortunately there is not a hard and fast rule for that. It depends on the operation. Sometimes I see results right away and sometimes I see them after a few days.

Samat said...

Cool. Even a few days is fine for me fulfilling the Chaos narrative that the servitor needs to mature after birth. But I still did another evocation of the angel and charged her to further empower and speed up the rearing process followed by spirit scrying of the servitor and I saw that it was like a baby twiddling, and the book I'm following (called Magickal Servitors) recommends continuous feeding of attention to the servitor for it to rear, which evolved it from a baby to a cub(animalistic servitor). Now we'll wait and see how it does. I also have a few friends who have been employing servitors for years so I'm not that worried xD xD xD xD.

You have very few articles on servitors, can I request a new one? xD

Did you know that it is possible to work with someone's else's servitors?

Scott Stenwick said...

I am not sure if the mechanism you describe there is really what is going on. I find some variation in how long it takes for a created spirit to "ramp up" and start showing results, but I don't know if it has anything to do with the "rearing process" or whatever. I just do the operation and wait and don't mess with it in any other way. The time to seeing first results just varies a lot.

When I get time to write one, sure. But what I think you'll find is that everything I say about talismans is also true of servitors. Basically a talisman just behaves like a servitor with a physical anchor. It's no more complicated than that.

Since a servitor is an independent spiritual entity and not a psychological projection, of course you can work with a servitor created by someone else - unless of course it was charged to only interact with the person who made it when it was created.

Samat said...

Hey Scott, I've learned recently that there are a few magicians such as the esteemed Christopher Warnock who make all their talismans on the same metal which is certainly not what the books recommend. Have you found that to work for you?

Scott Stenwick said...

When you get back into th3 1400s and 1500s, you do not see the metals standardized like you do with modern Qabalistic magick. Warnock goes with what the grimoire he's working with specifies, which does vary depending on the source.

Personally I have limited experience with it, but my understanding is that a lot of magicians claim to get good results going with the metal the grimoire specifies.

Samat said...

Brass or Bronze as a substitute for all planetary metals is not from the Picatrix. He came up with that himself. Both are alloys which work for him and his customers. Besides, most make their solar talismans on brass anyway just like your PELE ring. I'll just go with brass/bronze once I find a cheap source that sells in stocks.

Between talismans and petitions which seem to have a higher success rate for you and why? Talismans are the hardest goal of magick.

How to make petitions last as long as talismans i.e years?

Scott Stenwick said...

Just as a point, I do not substitute brass for all planetary metals and I do not generally make bronze talismans.

Brass can be substituted for gold on the basis of its color, Mercury on the basis of it being an alloy, and Venus on the basis on it being mostly copper.

Bronze can be used for Mercury on the basis of it being an alloy, Venus on the basis of it being mostly copper, and Jupiter on the basis of it containing tin - though it contains substantially more copper than tin and I generally use amethyst for Jupiter rather than a metal.

I still use iron for Mars, lead for Saturn, and silver for the Moon.

I don't do a lot of petitions, so I don't have a good enough sample size to make a comparison. I have had a lot of good results with talismans, though. I also haven't done enough work to speculate on how you would make a petition last over time, but my sense of it is that it would be pretty difficult.



Samat said...

Have returned with more knowledge about the decans. Turns out the decans are not zodiacal but planetary. It's a planet's position in a face/decan of the sign. Nothing zodiacal about them. This is why astrological magicians like the Picatrix community uses planetary elections, associations and materials for decan magick to complete effect. The only difference between us and them, they have no list of angels of the decans. They call/invoke the celestial spirit directly from the decan. The Moon is the most available planet for decan magick with 5 decans available a month.

Testament of Solomon is an extremely early source of 36 evil demons and their thwarting angels of the decans. Nick Farrell's Helios Unbound uses another source of 'daemons'. So the list of decan angels and demons varies from source to source. How do we know which is the accurate or the safest one to work with? Picatrix magicians avoid this issue entirely by invoking the nameless celestial spirit of the decan.

I also learned that the source for SOME of the decan angels that the Golden Dawn came up with is derived from the names found in Sefer Raziel. Mathers took these letters and spelled them out a bit differently for some reason. Compare 2nd decan of Aries angel BHMY(Raziel) with BHHMY (GD) and ABDRWN(GD) and ABDRWN(Raziel). Now I am convinced the list is accurate but to treat it as zodiac magick is inaccurate. This proves why the powers of the decans have little or nothing in common with the common powers of the sign.

Samat said...

As a second point, Saturn has been in its beneficial decan for over a year and it won't enter that decan again for another 30 years! God DAMN! I wasted entire 2023 not knowing that. Saturn will be exiting this decan on March 1 so I still have time to make use of its beneficent powers.

However, one or two applications are all this decan have to offer if we are not working general Saturn magick of course. Decans aren't that useful unfortunately. Can I also apply the principle of a force being able to accomplish something opposite of its powers, to decans?

Scott Stenwick said...

The decans have more specific powers than the planets which limit their utility to a degree. On the other hand, that's fine if one of the listed powers is exactly what you need.

I would think that decans rule by sphere of influence just like elements, planets, and signs, so you could work with a decan to both increase or decrease things related to its powers. This is supported by reports of decan talismans made during poor elections having opposite effects.

I never have experienced that myself so I think it's probably pretty rare, but the fact that it can happen at all means that it's possible and probably can be done deliberately.

Samat said...

Yes but as we know that people who work with the decans never use our Golden Dawn list compiled by Mathers. Those angels are not even in ancient sources. No known list of decan angels existed prior. You can write an article about that because decan and term magick is all the rage these days.

So people who used that decan during a poor election to have adverse results followed the Picatrix procedure by not calling any angels by name. They simply burn the incense and say something like 'by the One Most High, may the spirit of Mercury (or any other force) enter this talisman' while they engrave the image. They never learn the name of the spirit who was sent into their talisman. I believe this is why their workings can go horribly for them and a bad election is always the reason.

We do it completely differently. We conjure an angel and tell it to consecrate the talisman. That is how I've got them to work following your method.

So the final decan mystery for me is, would this decan angel of Mathers deliver just as good as the otherwise picatrix entity would have.

I'd have to practice. The Moon grants 5 decans to work with every month, that is the only planet that offers the most decan opportunities but most of them have limited use which is why I wanted to know if their opposite powers were also possible.

Scott Stenwick said...

As we know? That actually is not true. I know a number of people who do decan magick with the Mathers list and report good results. It is true that the Golden Dawn list is not in ancient sources, so you can certainly decide not to use it on those grounds. But to say nobody does, or that those who do don't get good results, is as far as I can tell not true at all.

Obviously you can't do Picatrix magick during poor elections. I don't know that I agree that things will always go badly for you if you do, but operations done on poor elections are not going to work well if they work at all. I also don't know of anyone who does this sort of magick without naming the spirit, but if they are out there I agree that it's a bad way to do it and probably won't produce good results.

As far as operations going "horribly wrong" I have to say I have yet to hear of a spell failure that really fits that description - like ever. Whereas I know of plenty of cases where operations just don't work - that is, they produce no apparent effects. That's the most common outcome with poorly done rituals. I also know of many cases where people were careless with charges and got what they asked for but not what they wanted. Those are common too.

The one person I know of online who I know of making claims that he had friends who "died horribly" from doing magick wrong is Clifford Low, and honestly I just don't believe him. I've been a part of the magical community here in the Twin Cities for over 30 years (Clifford and I are close to the same age, mid fifties) and known a lot of people who have done magick, both well and poorly. If magick kills people who do it wrong, I should be able to think of one case of it from all that time - and I can't. As far as I can tell it just doesn't happen. So I have no idea what Clifford is on about besides trying to stir up drama and get attention.

Samat said...

Do these people work with Mather's decan angels Solomonically meaning by conjuration or do they simply write the name of the angel on the talisman along with the picatrix image while they suffumigate it with the proper incense? The author of the Picatrix would be surprised to hear that we have found a list of angels for the decans thanks to Mathers.

Of course, I intend to work with the Mathers list. However I want to know if I can avoid the image because now we know the name of the spirit, I don't want to be a slave to the image. Picatrix magicians don't have this option and so their choice is limited only to the function of the image of the decan, but unlike the images, spirits can do many things.

Also in which house do you place pathworking? Since it is a thing of divination, house 9 was what people recommended me; the house of divination. I wish to pathwork to these angels but do you think that pathworking to Gabriel and asking her my questions about the specific powers of the lunar decans as well as the lunar mansions would be proper or should one pathwork to the specific angel of the aspect?

Samat said...

Also, when you're doing elemental magick, do you still use talismans which are for a permanent charge or do you prefer petitions?

Scott Stenwick said...

I do not necessarily know all the details of practice from folks reporting results, but I generally think people who work with the Mathers list would be doing Golden Dawn or Thelemic style magick rather than Picatrix style stuff. Some of my students have found you can combine the methods and it seems to work - go through the conjuration of the angel, draw the image on the talisman, and then deliver a more specific charge than the general power related to the image.

Gabriel should have that information. As the general angel of the Moon, you probably are more likely to get a correct answer than if you are trying to guess at the right house angel. I don't work with the houses very much, but divination seems like a logical attribution to me.

I will either (A) create a talisman to anchor the effect or (B) directly deliver a charge to the spirit. I don't really work with petitions aside from a few experiments years ago, unless you consider (B) a petition. I personally don't - I see it as a charge.

Samat said...

>(B) directly deliver a charge to the spirit. I don't really work with petitions aside from a few experiments years ago, unless you consider (B) a petition.

I thought all this time that you meant (B) to be a petition. How do you have a different definition of petitions? So far, we only have one definition of a petition and that is (B), delivering charge directly to the spirit or as Picatrix does, directly to the hierarchy of spirits. However, I've not come across the idea anywhere that a petition anchors the operation to the magician. They do agree though that it lasts a few years but is not perpetual.

As for divination, a few weeks ago I did a divination prior to an Air ritual that clearly said that the operation will fail but I went ahead with it nonetheless for experimentation's sake and indeed it failed. The spirits failed. Geomancy divination is really hard as it is, so I don't know why it failed but I'm glad the truth was ascertained prior to the failure. However, it did smack the confidence out of me regarding the 4 elements.

How do you decide to do it all over again or choose a different power entirely?

I have another question, this time about incense. I recently met a Picatrix practitioner who told me he uses frankincense for all planets successfully. This statement is repeated within the magickal community in general, but everyone prefers their list of incenses in the grimoires. Even Saturn loves frankincense according to some accounts. Can you tell me a bit about it from your experience?

Scott Stenwick said...

Okay, just wanted to make sure we were talking about the same thing. I was not clear on that for a minute there. In my experience direct charges like that do anchor to the magician, and the more you have going at once the less powerful each will be. That's not from any esoteric source that I can point to, it's a finding from my own research. Take that as you will.

You can do multiple divinations. Start with "If I do this operation calling on power X, what will happen?" If you get back that it will fail, see what you can tweak to fix whatever the problem is. There's some overlap between the various powers, so you could find another power that could potentially match and try "What if I do this operation calling on power Y instead of power X?" and then see what the divination says. Once you identify a successful power, go with that.

Incenses are pretty flexible. You don't necessarily need to use the exact planetary incense from 777 or anything like that. Frankincense in particular can be used for a lot of different powers and they don't seem to mind. So I'm not surprised somebody would report using it for all the planets successfully.

Samat said...

Yes, I went ahead with the Air talisman despite the divination foretelling the outcome for experimentation's sake. The only thing different I could have done was choose a different election, a different element or a different way of conjuring the spirits. The other 3 elements are still a possible candidate for the outcome I am seeking.

I wish to share that my Libra talisman has failed to deliver, and the deadline has passed. Looking at the election, I accidentally missed the date by a day causing the Moon to be afflicted by Jupiter. My geomancy divination showed the court to be unsure: conjunctio as the judge meaning that it chances were very slim. And H4 (House 4) showed Amissio (loss) which means that at the end of the matter, there will be loss which I take to mean the ritual will fail. And the house of the target also came up with an ambiguous sign. Man it's unbelievable how accurate divination is. When it says no, it means no. When it says yes, it means yes. When it says 'depends, not sure', it means it could go either way. Had I not missed the original election by a day as intended, perhaps Zuriel might have achieved.

Let's just assume that Libra was the most appropriate power for that task, what could I have done differently? For one, I did not pathwork to Zuriel to ask for his approval, so no introductions there. I only conjured him and gave the charge.

As for pathworking, yesterday I did a pathworking to Gabriel inside Yesod, however geomancy divination afterwards revealed that I in fact did not pathwork to Gabriel, Carcer as judge. Though it did seem convincing to me. So I guess I need to try it again and again? I asked Gabriel for a personal name to connect with her and she gave 'Levanah' which just means Moon in Hebrew, so there's a clue that it might have been my imagination.

For comparison, I was once about to do my first pathworking to Hanael of Capricorn and divination discouraged it for the night. Then I did it a few days later and divination indeed confirmed that the pathworking was successful and the answers Hanael gave such as the directions to face for her, the incense she likes but nothing more.

Samat said...

So how is it that divination can say whether a time is right for a pathworking or not? Should we listen to divination about whether it's ok to do a pathworking or should we do a pathworking first and divine whether we actually communicated with the spirit or not. Both are equally viable to me but it seems divination still prefers to tell us what is right or wrong.

Scott Stenwick said...

As I see it you can do it either way. I would leave that up to your personal preference, or what feels right at the time you do the operation.

Samat said...

I have a concern against using talismans for everything. For example, grimoires recommend to place talismans near or in the place you want to affect. So a talisman to make a place safer should be in there, a talisman to make a place more corrupt should be near the place. Likewise, when you make a talisman to heal a relative living abroad, how do they even get to benefit from it if it is not in on their person? Surely, petitions must have *some* benefit over talismans?

Scott Stenwick said...

Talismans need to be linked to a target, using similarity or contagion links. Then they do not need to be physically close to what you want to affect. You can also link them to yourself this way and then you do not need to carry them around or wear them. A direct operation/petition has the same issue. For it to work on a distant target you need a magical link in the table of art when you do the conjuration.

The advantage of a direct operation/petition is that they are a little more powerful if they are the only operation you have running. Some of the power you raise when you create a talisman is taken up by stabilizing the talisman itself. Because of this, I was able to determine experimentally that talismans produce about 80% of the probability shift of a direct operation. However, if you have more than one going at the same time your magical power gets split between all the operations you have running.

A talisman is independent and does not have that limitation. You can have a million talismans going if you want and they won't affect your available magical power. If you're not happy with 80% of the effect that a talisman will produce, make two of them in separate operations. Each will run at 80% of the direct operation shift and give you 160% of what you could do with a petition/direct operation.

But as I always say, those are my findings. Feel free to experiment for yourself and see if you get different results.

Samat said...

I assume that you found these conclusions after charging the same spirit(s) via petitions and talismans for the same task, most probably a one-off task, at different times otherwise it would become incredibly difficult to ascertain the results because
(a) your relationship with the spirit would improve with each charge which enhances the results, correct?
(b) the circumstances changed with the election and the situation affecting the results

Astrological magicians do tell me that talismans have advantages over petitions but only minimal and that too in quantity only; firstly, being that the talisman can function perpetually and secondly being that petitions permit the spirits to have a broader reach, whereas the talisman is localized. They tell me that they do petitions for other people primarily who would never wear a talisman.

You and others who follow the same pattern of conjuring a spirit and charging it to empower a talisman with X purpose on the other hand, might have revolutionized the method. Agrippa gives zero details on how to work with petitions and Picatrix was translated much later.

And as you told me before, for a continual purpose a talisman will be perfect for it can operate on the issue perpetually and they also told me that a petition has more horsepower like you found yourself.

But what about Enochian? Does this extend to Enochian magick too?


Also, are there spirits with whom the results don't improve over time?

Scott Stenwick said...

I am well aware that the testing I have done is difficult and not necessarily conclusive. That is why I recommend you do your own experiments instead of relying on my opinions. You might get different results than I did. But if you ask my opinions, they are going to be based on my own experiments because that is the information that I have obtained over years of working with this material.

Yes, Enochian works the same way in my experience.

I would expect that hostile spirits that don't really want to work with you probably would not get better over time. I can't be sure about that, though, since usually if a spirit is hostile towards something I want to get done I just find another one with similar powers that is more willing to be helpful.

Samat said...

Scott, which powers would be best for cancellation of something? Such as an event, program, activity etc. You probably best experience with this type of magick because you have done political magick.

I have a few candidates but I have no clue which would be the best: Saturn/Earth (restriction and root cutting), Jupiter/Sagittarius (transformation), Moon/Cancer (magnetization of cancellation), Libra (equilibrium), and Pisces (ending of things).

Libra didn't work for me on an entirely different issue so it would be my last pick.

Scott Stenwick said...

Saturn is the most obvious. It is directly related to ending things and restricting things.

Sagittarius could also work, since transformation is a pretty general power.

Something ending is not very "magnetizable," if that makes sense. So I wouldn't go with Cancer.

Libra is "works of justice and equilibrium," so I wouldn't go with that either.

Pisces is "bewitchments and casting illusions," which doesn't seem very related. So I wouldn't go with that.

I would say if you want to go planetary, Saturn is good. If you wan to go zodiacal, go with Sagittarius. Elemental the best would probably be Earth - it's cold (lack of energy/activity) and dry (immutable in structure).

Samat said...

I think Cancer is wrong. It can be asked to magnetize the event with the desired circumstances but not the end of the event itself.

I knew you would pick Saturn first because it is the most obvious choice but I can't help but feel that Jupiter and Sagittarius are also proper candidates. This is because Jupiter rules power, prestige. Sagittarius is even better because it rules higher education, so imagine cancelling an event in an educational institution or related to it.

I mentioned Pisces because one astrological power of Pisces is ending of journeys like how Aries denotes the beginning of journeys (fire). It's not in 777.


Also, I just came up with this now. Moon and Mercury are the planets people go to for road opening spells so I think they can be asked to close the road as well, which isn't exactly the same as cessation of things. And moon elections pop up twice every month.

Scorpio is the sign of death, of both individuals and situations(devil card). Mars, as you write is too extreme for things Saturn can easily do so I assume that Scorpio likewise can be called for swift endings. Saturn is considered a slow and melancholic planet of rot and decay. The grimoires always describe Scorpio for driving something out, such as Scorpios from your city.

So in conclusion I think it depends on the wording of our charge. If we say, "Barakhiel, use the power of your sign Scorpio to bring a swift 'death' to this event."

Or, "Gabriel/Raphael, use your powers of road opening to close off this event."

Or, "Sachiel use your powers of political ascendancy to demote this event".

Samat said...

Coming back to Cancer, have you been able to use its enchantment power to cause or influence major change, especially towards political magick? I just think that the zodiac powers line up more perfectly with political goals.

Scott Stenwick said...

It absolutely depends on your charge and how you put it together. I suspect any of those could be made to work, just have not tried all of them. It is important too to look at the condition of specific planets or signs. Even if the power might generally be the best one for the job, the wrong aspect or placement can make it less effective than it might otherwise be, and going with a different power might work better.

I have not tried Cancer for political operations myself, but I don't see a reason that it wouldn't work. Enchantment is a pretty general power.

Samat said...

Now I actually really want you to do a non-enochian Cancer talisman for political grifs xD xD xD.

You live in Minnesota right? I imagine that the city has political problems like every other city in the world and Muriel can be forced into the talisman to cause the change.

Is it the same as with other signs that Cancer's magnetization power takes a lot of time to start magnetizing? I made mine last week with a clear intention but I'm still result-free despite divination foretelling that it's very well worth doing this operation.

Samat said...

Hey Scott. We've discussed the stages of divination before doing spellwork and we've agreed that it's worth it especially if it agrees with doing magick but what if you did an operation and waited for two months and did not see any results and the need was being felt more than ever and so you did a follow up reading to know how it's working and it returned that we have to part ways with this dud of a talisman because, like we suspected, it didn't do anything?

Scott Stenwick said...

I have so many other things on my list that I do not imagine getting to that any time soon. Feel free to try it yourself and report back, though.

Yes, all the zodiac signs tend to take more time to manifest. Changes are generally bigger but take longer than with elements and planets.

Sometimes talismans just don't work and that's the way it goes. It's hard to diagnose the problem reliably, since magick is by its nature kind of chaotic. After decades of practice I usually don't get those, but they still do happen from time to time.

That's what's nice about using a deadline. The deadline expires and you can see whether it worked or not. If it didn't, cast again for another similar period and see. I've gotten duds, but not two in a row.

In addition to divination, it's important to look for partial successes. If some things went the way of the charge but it wasn't fulfilled completely, it could mean that the charge is for something too unlikely for the talisman to completely shift.

Samat said...

Maybe Minnesotans don't deserve good things xD.

I understand that the zodiac signs have those powers precisely because the signs represent archetypal qualities best. Even now when I discuss simple things like wealth and health in regard to the signs, they dismiss is immediately. It would be cool if people experimented with the signs more.

I consulted with geomancy regarding if asking Kambriel to empower an Aquarius talisman to affect a few other future talismans with the intention to overcome, mitigate the negative aspects so as to enhance the astrological effects on the talismans I wanted to make for a particular goal so I won't be calling on Kambriel for that. If you have practically found this power to be true, then my chart was lying to me. In geomancy, you just throw dice and interpret the answer.

However, I asked whether Ghob could be useful for a different purpose and it agreed, and this was a no brainer because the goal corresponds directly to Earth and probably also because elements are available 24/7. This proves to me that the divination gods are cowards, because I also learned from it that a lunar mansion will also be great for me but Sun, Jupiter and Saturn won't. I threw charts for a few Shem angels, a few zodiacal archangels such as Adnakhiel and it all returned no. When it settled on an entirely different zodiacal archangel, which also makes sense to be honest, I understood why Earth would be the best power for this purpose, both elementally and zodiacally.

However, going with elemental operations, I don't want to be low on power. You were experimentally able to find out that two talismans bring up the power to about 160% and I think that's 10x worth going for than other options. Hell even 3 separate talismans by the same elemental King will work towards the purpose. You already agree with this. I think it can work.
But wouldn't the different elections empower the talismans differently? How can they harmoniously work towards the same goal without interfering? Have you confirmed something there as well?

Also, could a slow or weak additional talisman weaken the overall power output of both talismans? Imagine Paralda going both ways and getting split in the middle like a Tom and Jerry episode lmao xD.

Samat said...

Now I don't know why geomancy said that Kambriel and Adnakhiel would have been horrible talismans for my goal. But maybe having two or three of those talismans might have negated the negative effects. We will never know.

Scott Stenwick said...

The Enochian approach works so well that if I have something I need done, I am not going to screw around with something that might not work as well. I would want to do some experiments in less crucial contexts to verify. And right now I don't have a lot of time for that. It is what it is.

Yes, the fact that the multiple talismans will have different elections does mean that their power will vary to a degree, because the election locks in the astrological conditions for how each talisman will work. Ideally you would find decent elections for all of them and then there should only be a slight variance.

Each talisman is its own unique entity. When you have a talisman empowered by, say, Paralda, it's not Paralda doing the the things the talisman is charged to do. It's more like a servitor or something created by Paralda that accomplishes those tasks. So the elections are entirely independent. Adding a talisman with a bad election to a group won't help much because it won't do much, but it won't degrade the power of others in the group.

Samat said...

Then what is Muriel even good for?

Scott Stenwick said...

Muriel's powers are those outlined in my article on The Zodiacal Work - Cancer.

https://ananael.blogspot.com/2017/02/the-zodiacal-work-cancer.html

Also potentially anything else related by astrologers to the sign Cancer.

Samat said...

xD xD xD. No I mean, in the context of our ongoing conversation where you said the Enochian approach to zodiacal magick works so well that you don't need to experiment with the hermetic approach to Cancer, what is even the point in your personal practice to work with Muriel?

Enochian magick will be the death of all hermetic magick.

Scott Stenwick said...

I said Enochian worked so well for political operations specifically. For Muriel's other powers that's not necessarily the case.

I said nothing there about Enochian versus Hermetic magick in general. You're reading that into my comments.

Samat said...

Yes I remember you telling me that the Enochian Zodiacal system, is first and foremost for political operations involving the Parts of the Earth. For that it's the best system you've ever come across and when using the Zodiacal angels of the Aires for Hermetic zodiacal powers such as those from 777 you found them to be on par.

In both cases, we only get one spirit for the sign; the zodiacal King and the zodiacal Agrippa archangel.

Have you ever experimented by calling both of them? I know that Enochian and Hermetic Kabbalah should not be mixed together but I see no reason why each can't work independently.

Samat said...

As you answer that, can you tell me whether we can do magick during this solar eclipse? Astrological magicians are not considering it but I want to know your thoughts.

Secondly, I want to share that I believe I have build a sort of relationship with Sandalphon over the past few weeks. Any elemental ritual I do, I call him first to act as an intermediary as I place his lunar kamea sigil on the table and conjure him in the name of ADNI Melekkh. Once the timer goes off, I conjure the elemental king through him, so these double conjurations take me 10 minutes.

Sandalphon himself does not get any charge but the elemental king. Is this how a relationship is built in practice? I believe I have done it.

Each time I have conjured a King this way, geomancy has shown that it was indeed successful. Last time I conjured Michael of fire to consecrate a talisman and burned some expensive frankincense incense. The divination showed that he was not conjured and the talisman also feels like a dud. So it seems to me that Sandalphon while very powerful - being an archangel - does not have any authority to force any spirit that is uninterested. This is something that my pathworking with Raziel a long time ago confirmed for me as well.

Scott Stenwick said...

I am not going to tell you that you can or can't do magick during an eclipse. The traditional sources generally say no, which is why the astrological magicians aren't considering it. That may be good advice.

However, I have done some magical work during eclipses before, working with both the Sun and Moon, and I am going to be trying something for this one. Previous operations have worked to a degree, though I can't say that I've had an especially outstanding result. It's possible that the eclipse energy messes with energy of the ritual a bit instead of doing anything helpful. But that's something that I'm still trying to work out.

What I will tell you is that nothing catastrophic has ever happened to me doing magick during an eclipse. The worst that happens is the operation doesn't work well, and I'm not sure why some operations work fine and others don't.

For building a relationship with a spirit, yes, that's how you do it. You keep working with the same spirit over time and "getting to know them," so to speak. I haven't personally worked with Sandalphon as an intermediary, but if it's working for you keep going with it.

Samat said...

Are there any spirits of Kether, Chokhmah or Malkuth in Enochian system? If so that would be great.

Scott Stenwick said...

Apologies for the delay, I have been out of town for a few days.

The problem with that sort of attribution in the Enochian system is (1) it's not clear that the attributions in the system are Qabalistic at all and (2) the Enochian system predates the both the Kircher Tree of Life and the Rosenroth Tree of Life that Mathers used as the basis for the Golden Dawn system. It's pretty clear in Enochian how to map to planets, elements, and signs but not so much beyond that.

You can connect Saturn with Binah and the zodiacal Angelic Kings with Chockmah based on Kircher/Rosenroth, but it's not clear at all what would map to Kether. Maybe LIL, the First Aire? But that doesn't necessarily map cleanly either.

Samat said...

Apology accepted.

If there is no such attribution, then I would take Metatron, Raziel and Sandalphon as angels set higher than any Enochian king. I mean how can there be something equivalent to the archangels of the sephirot in another system? Sephirots are abstract ideas that give rise to the paths right? The Gnostic Aeons. The highest of the highest. The supercelestial set above the celestial. In other words, can never be anything higher than Metatron, Raziel and Sandalphon.

Merlyn78 said...

Hi Scott,

I have a question about the classification of the Goetic Spirit, Bifrons.
Some sources classify him as being a spirit of Jupiter. According to some of the information on Astrology I found online, Jupiter, while influencing politics, also influences spirituality and education. So, would Jupiter be correct for him? Or would Mercury or the Moon be more appropriate?

Bifrons:
His Office is to make one knowing in Astrology, Geometry, and
other Arts and Sciences. He teaches the Virtues of Precious Stones
Planet: Jupiter and Woods. He changes Dead Bodies, and puts them in another
place; also he lights astral Candles upon the Graves of the
Dead.

Thanks.

Scott Stenwick said...

As a caveat for this question, I have done very little work with Goetic spirits. So I may not be the best person to ask, and my thoughts on this might not be very useful.

A question - are there other sources relating Bifrons to Mercury or the Moon? Or just to Jupiter? If your sources say Jupiter and Mercury or Moon is more like a guess on your part, go with Jupiter and see how it works. The grimoires are attributed the way they are for a reason.

Once you learn the established way of working with them, feel free to experiment. But I usually find that people who look at a grimoire and want to change stuff before even working with it don't generally get good results.

Samat said...

Then how to take the relationship with Sandalphon further? I only call him when I need to call another spirit in the table of art via conjuration. Sometimes I feel it worked, sometimes it didn't because results would not pull through so I just took to conjuring him prior to any other conjuration in the hopes that he would appear more and more often in case he wasn't.

Scott Stenwick said...

I personally don't work with Sandalphon that way so it's hard to give you advice that isn't just speculation. Generally speaking, though, you build a relationship with a spirit by working with them and doing operations with them. I would expect that your relationship with Sandalphon should deepen over time with repeated workings.

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