Monday, November 14, 2016

The Planetary Work - Saturn

This article is Part One in a series.

Over the years, I've posted a number of articles on planetary magick. After putting together the elemental work series, it seems to me that the time is right to put together a new set of these rituals reflecting some updates in my methodology. I have been able to refer people who ask questions to the older rituals, but sometimes that prompts more questions about why things are done as they are when I abandoned them years ago. So what I am writing up now is the planetary work the way I currently perform it. This article may be considered an updated version of this one, which is how I was working with Saturn ten years ago.

As just one example, I used to think it was a lot more important to work through the entire spiritual hierarchy to "get to" the spirit you wanted to work with. What I've found in practice, though, is that it works just as well to conjure the spirit you want using the overall godname - for the most part. The one exception is that with an Agrippa planetary spirit, you do need to conjure the corresponding intelligence in order to get the best results. Even there, though, you can also just conjure the planetary angel and basically delegate the work. This turns out to work about as well as digging into the Intelligences and Spirits, and it is simpler because you only have to conjure a single entity.

To start off, the planetary work as presented here is the essence of the most popular practical magical operations. Jupiter and the Sun correspond to status, wealth, and prosperity. Venus corresponds to love, and Mercury corresponds to healing. Saturn and Mars correspond to both cursing and magical protection. And finally, the Moon corresponds to clairvoyance, dreamwork, and psychic perception. As a magick blogger, I find that the vast majority of people writing me for spells want something in one of those areas, and it's really no surprise. That list includes most of what magick is famous for, and the kinds of powers that most people really want.

In Qabalah, the planets correspond to the double letters of the Hebrew alphabet. The letters are so named because they correspond to two specific sounds each, and this is reflected in the dual nature of the planets. On the Tree of Life, each planet corresponds to both a sephira or a path. Many magicians refer to the sephiroth as "spheres," and you may catch me doing that sometimes as well. It is, however, not a direct translation. The word actually means "emanations" - as in, emanations of divinity. But they are drawn as circles on most diagrams of the Tree of Life, and in addition, "sephira" and "sphere" sound very similar in English.


The important thing to understand about this for practical magick is that the sephira represent states of emanation, while the paths represent movement between them. Invoking the emanations themselves produces particular visions and states of consciousness, and invoking the paths produces particular practical effects. In Liber 777, the paths and sephira have separate sets of colors, separate angels, and even separate godnames. It is relatively common for people working practical magick to ignore these factors, and, say, conjure the angel of a sephira rather than a path. Often said angel is smart enough to figure out what you really want, but it works better if you go for the right aspect from the start. If you review my older article, you can see that back then I wasn't making this distinction. Adding it has helped my work immensely.

For this series, I will be starting out with Saturn and working down the Tree of Life, following what is called the Chaldean Order. As the elemental series ascended the elements in density order, this one will descend according to the relative astrological motion of each planet, from slowest (Saturn) to fastest (The Moon). Note that the ancient system does not include the outer planets in this schema, so I will not be covering them as part of this series. The sevenfold division is found throughout the magical tradition, and it works just fine as it is.

This series will be covering the paths, as they correspond to practical magical operations. I will be putting together a series that deals with the sephira once I have covered the practical work. This is by design - some schools teach that you should master a bunch of mystical stuff before you start casting effective spells, and I just don't buy that. You should use magick for basically everything, and you should start doing it right away. Studying the differences between successes and failures will give you essential insights into the nature of your will and the quality of your technique, and besides, doing effective practical magick is awesome.

According to Liber 777, the path of Saturn corresponds to "Works of Malediction and Death." That is, cursing. Saturn is referred to as the "Greater Malefic" in traditional astrology, so this matches its nature well. But an important point here for the beginning magician who doesn't necessarily care about casting curses is that Saturn rules works of malediction and death. So not only can you call upon Saturn to curse someone, you can call upon the planet to protect you from such operations, and to keep you safe from threats to your life.

This principle holds true with the other planets as well - they can be employed in both positive and negative ways according to their sphere of influence. Mercury, for example, rules healing, but the angel of Mercury could also be employed to negatively affect a target's health. As another example, Venus rules love, but the angel of Venus could also be employed to break up a romantic relationship, or to protect and existing relationship from such influence. And so forth.

So it is not the case, as I thought when I was starting in on this that, say, you would banish Saturn in order to protect yourself from curses and only invoke if you were casting one. This can kind of work, but as the banishing itself is momentary rather than persistant, it doesn't work all that well. You are much better off conjuring the angel of Saturn and giving a charge related to protection from curses. Then the angel can keep the effect going over time, and basically keep watching out for you, holding any subsequent curses at bay.

For the Path of Saturn, the four scales of color are Indigo, Black, Blue Black, and Black Rayed Blue. For ceremonial forms, you use the King scale, which is Indigo. Its complement is pale yellow. All four scales should be used to construct the sigil of the angel. The first piece of sigil is the character of Saturn, which looks like this:


The angel of the path of Saturn is Cassiel, spelled Kaph-Shin-Yod-Aleph-Lamed. The Saturn kamea is 3 x 3, so these letters all need to be reduced to single digits. This yields 2 (20), 3 (300), 1 (10), 1, and 3 (30), to produce a sigil on the kamea that looks like this:


Note that some sources teach the spelling Cassiel as Kaph-Samekh-Yod-Aleph-Lamed. I don't know why this differs from the text of Liber 777, my main source for magical operations. It is possible that Aleister Crowley changed the spelling, or that one is a corruption of the other. With Samekh, you get 2 (20), 6 (60), 1 (10), 1, and 3 (30). That sigil would look like this:


As you can see, a single letter change can result in a very different-looking symbol. I use the Shin spelling in my own work, but at the same time, I'm all about experimentation. If you're curious, feel free to try both and see which one works best for you.

The final sigil is created by combining the two figures, shown here using the Shin spelling. The grid is not necessary, but I have still included it here to show the geometry. There is no formal method for determining which color goes where on the sigil, but it should include all four scales so that it will span all four Qabalistic worlds and thus constitute a complete symbol. This is largely left to your own ingenuity.


From Liber 777, incenses appropriate to Saturn are Assofoetida, Scammony, Indigo, Sulphur, and "all evil odors." Associated plants are Ash, Cypress, Yew, Nightshade, and Elm. The associated metal is lead, and the associated precious stone is onyx.

The plants may be dried and ground into a powder using a mortar and pestle and can be sprinkled onto the paper talisman as an offering to the angel. You can do the same with assofoetida, which in powdered form is a spice. Likewise, a piece of lead or onyx may be placed on top of the paper talisman for the conjuration. You then use the paper to wrap up the whole thing when the ritual is complete and somehow bind or tape it together.

The god-name in Assiah for the path of Saturn is AB (Aleph-Beth). It is far more common for Saturn operations to be taught using YHVH Elohim as the god-name for Saturn, but this is actually the god-name appropriate to Binah, the sephira of Saturn. This is a key distinction that few teachers make, and is a method that we have explored at the local Leaping Laughter Lodge Ritual Workshop. It appears to be quite effective, and allows you to make a meaningful distinction between sephiroth and paths in the context of the ceremonial forms.

The full ritual is performed as follows:

0. The Temple

The best time to perform a Saturn operation is on a Saturday, during the hour of Saturn. To calculate the hours, divide the time between sunrise and sunset into twelve equal parts to get the hours of the day, and the time between sunset and sunrise into twelve equal parts to get the hours of the night. Days begin at sunrise. The first hour of the day is attributed to the planet ruling the day, and the subsequent hours are assigned according to the Chaldean Order.

Saturn --> Jupiter --> Mars --> Sun --> Venus --> Mercury --> Moon

Following the hour of the Moon, the order starts over again with Saturn. While it seems complicated as first, once you do it a bunch, you'll find that it actually is pretty easy. At this point I can almost do it in my head. There are also a number of software programs that you can download to do the calculation for you, and even some websites that will tell you the hours.

There are a number of different ways to arrange the temple for an operation such as this. What we do is place an altar in the center with the banishing dagger and invoking wand. Also on the altar is a containment structure such as the Sigillum Dei Aemeth or the Trithemian Table of Art. The diagram depicting the character and sigil should be placed within this structure. A small container of some sort for offerings may be placed on the Table of Art, or you can sprinkle the offering directly upon the diagram itself.


The Table of Art shown above is from The Digital Ambler. You can read about the design and how it was put together here. You can click on the image to enlarge.

If you employ scrying in your work, an appropriate device such as a crystal or mirror should also be placed in the containment structure. If you are using incense for such an operation, the traditional method is to place the incense burner between the scryer and the mirror or crystal. Otherwise, it may be placed anywhere in the space. Some scryers like to place a taper candle on either side of the device, and while I can't say that method does anything at all for me, a number of others report good results with it.

1. Opening

Light incense, if used. Open the magical field using the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram and Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram, Star Ruby and Star Sapphire, or the Field Ritual. The usual field for practical work is the operant field, with banishing pentagrams and invoking hexagrams.

2. Preliminary Invocation

Raise energy using the Middle Pillar, Elevenfold Seal (the "First Gesture" from Liber V vel Reguli), or some other appropriate ritual method as you may know how to do.

Make the Sign of Apophis and Typhon, raising both arms and holding them straight with an angle between them of 60 degrees, and proclaim, very strongly:

Thee I invoke, who art Universe!
Thee I invoke, who art in Nature formed!
Thee I invoke, the vast and the mighty!
Source of Darkness, Source of Light.

Then make the Sign of Silence, by standing straight with one arm at your side and placing your thumb or forefinger to your lips.


3. Tuning the Space

Perform the Greater Ritual of the Hexagram for Saturn. Beginning in the east, go to each quarter in turn and perform the following actions.

  1. 1. Trace the Hexagram of Saturn in indigo while vibrating ARARITA (ah-rah-ree-tah). The hexagram of Saturn is traced by starting at the top point and tracing the upright triangle clockwise, and then moving on to the bottom point and tracing the downward triangle clockwise.
  2. Trace the symbol of Saturn in the center of the hexagram in pale yellow while vibrating AB (ahb).
The final figure being traced to all four directions should look like this:


Once the four figures are traced, return to face the east completing the circle.

Then, recite the Orphic Hymn to Saturn.

Etherial father, mighty Titan, hear,
Great fire of Gods and men, whom all revere:
Endu'd with various council, pure and strong,
To whom perfection and decrease belong.
Consum'd by thee all forms that hourly die,
By thee restor'd, their former place supply;
The world immense in everlasting chains,
Strong and ineffable thy pow'r contains
Father of vast eternity, divine,
O mighty Saturn, various speech is thine:
Blossom of earth and of the starry skies,
Husband of Rhea, and Prometheus wife.
Obstetric Nature, venerable root,
From which the various forms of being shoot;
No parts peculiar can thy pow'r enclose,
Diffus'd thro' all, from which the world arose,
O, best of beings, of a subtle mind,
Propitious hear to holy pray'rs inclin'd;
The sacred rites benevolent attend,
And grant a blameless life, a blessed end.

The space should now be tuned for the conjuration.

4. The Conjuration

Note: It has come to my attention that the manner in which I do the conjuration is less clear than I originally intended. The conjuration has been clarified to reflect this point, but it is significant enough to discuss and draw attention to it here. First of all, I am NOT working my way down through the hierarchy to get to "the guy at the bottom" (the spirit) who actually does the work. In fact, I address my charge to ALL THREE entities called below.

If the Godname is included, the four names represent the four Qabalistic worlds - Godname = Atziluth, Angel = Briah, Intelligence = Yetzirah, Spirit = Assiah). By addressing the charge in this way, the operation can "fire on all cylinders" and affect the manifest universe at all level. The Godname represents the power itself, the Angel ushers that power across the Abyss from potential to actual, the Intelligence shapes that power through the realm of formation, and the Spirit interfaces that power directly with the material world from moment to moment.


CASSIEL, CASSIEL, CASSIEL (kah-see-EL). Come unto me, great and mighty angel of SHABBATAI (shah-bah-TYE) by the name of the great god AB (AHB). Send unto me AGIEL (ah-ghee-EL), that great intelligence of thine, and thereafter attend to my behest.

Pause until the presence of Cassiel is perceived. If you don’t feel anything or see anything, wait a minute or so before continuing.

AGIEL, AGIEL, AGIEL (ah-ghee-EL). Come unto me, thou bright intelligence of SHABBATAI (shah-bah-TYE), in the name of CASSIEL (kah-see-EL) thy lord. Compel the spirit ZAZEL (zah-ZEL) who is under thy dominion to manifest within this Table of Art, and thereafter attend to my behest.

Pause until the presence of Agiel is perceived. If you don’t feel anything or see anything, wait a minute or so before continuing.

ZAZEL, ZAZEL, ZAZEL (zah-ZEL). Come unto me, mighty spirit of SHABBATAI (shah-bah-TYE), in the name of AGIEL (ah-ghee-EL) thy lord. Come forth within this Table of Art and thereafter attend to my behest, that I may wield the powers of TAU (pronounced like it looks), the path of the planet Saturn.

At this point, vibrate the names CASSIEL, AGIEL, and ZAZEL repeatedly until the presence of the angel and spirits of Saturn is perceived within the Table of Art. Various methods may be used to accomplish this, from simply waiting until a presence makes itself known to scrying for an image in a crystal or dark mirror. If this is being performed as a group ritual, with everyone chanting the name together, it is helpful for the officiant or scryer to have a bell chime that can be rung once he or she perceives a presence in whatever manner. At the bell chime, the chant stops.

5. The Charge

My instructions for the charge are simple and straightforward, just as you can find in my published books. Address it to all three named entities above. Make use of an Injunction, which is what you want the angel and associated spirits to do, and a Limitation, which is what you do not want them to do. The Limitation helps you avoid "Monkey's Paw" situations in which your Injunction may manifest, but in an undesirable way.

As I mentioned above, Liber 777 catalogs the powers attributed to the planet Saturn as "Works of Malediction and Death." For best results, your charge should fall within that area. Otherwise, you may be asking for something outside Saturn's sphere of influence, and that could cause the ritual to fail. Keep in mind that as Saturn rules this area, you can call upon Cassiel to protect you from such harm, not just to cast curses.

At this point you may also make offerings to the angel by placing them in the small container. After the angel has had a chance to partake of the offerings, be sure to dispose of them. Alcohol such as wine may be allowed to evaporate on its own, and natural substances may be scattered outdoors. Do not attempt to reuse an offering - generally speaking, spirits do not take kindly to that.

Your other option is to place the offerings directly upon the sigil itself, if this is practical, as it is with ground-up plant material or spices. If you decide to go this route, you will be wrapping the offering up in the paper sigil and need give it no further thought. Obviously, though, this becomes less practical with liquid offerings, such as alcohol.

Also, You should get some sort of assent from the angel before you proceed to the License to Depart, or an explanation of his objection. When the charge lies outside the angel's sphere of influence, often he will be willing to direct you to another spirit that would be more suitable to conjure in order to better accomplish your intent.

6. The License to Depart

Mighty CASSIEL and the spirits of Thy domain, because thou hast-diligently answered unto my demands, and hast been very ready and willing to come at my call, I do hereby license thee to depart unto thy proper place, without causing harm or danger unto man or beast. I charge thee to withdraw peaceably and quietly with the blessings of the great god AB, and that peace be ever continued between us. So mote it be!

7. Closing

The ritual may be closed with either a final banishing pentagram ritual or with the Qabalistic Cross performed on its own. These should match the rituals used in the opening, so for example if you opened with a Star Ruby you should repeat it or perform the corresponding version of the Qabalistic Cross.

Generally speaking, if you want to release your intent out into the world to accomplish some task external to yourself, you should close with a banishing pentagram ritual. This is similar to the chaos magick idea of releasing a sigil once it has been created and empowered.

On the other hand, if you also want the effect of the ritual to linger within your sphere of awareness, whether or not the intent is also external, you should close with the Qabalistic Cross. This stabilizes the operation, but does not detach it from your sphere of awareness.

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109 comments:

Anonymous said...

Like i said of fb, Splendid!

About the sigil of the angel: can't we use the specific sigils for the planetary angels from Agrippa? Or were they meant to be used when working with the powers of the sphere, instead of the path? And for the path we should create the specific sigil using the corresponding planetary kamea.

Now that you mention RO, i've seen articles of his in which he detailed certain rituals. In those rituals he used the Agrippa's sigils for the planetary angels to call upon the archangels - in this case using Cassiel's sigil to call upon Tzaphkiel. I used Sachiel's sigil to call upon Tzadkiel in my own Jupiter workings and it worked for me.

Scott Stenwick said...

Sure, you could do that too. One of the things that I am trying to do with this series is put together a consistent methodology across the full traditional symbol set - elements, planets, and signs. But that does not mean the methods I propose here are the only way to do it, or the "right" way. Spirits can be linked to more than one sigil and can be conjured using various different methods.

There is some overlap between the sphere and path angels, but I am not sure whether they are different aspects of the same entity, or separate entities with closely related attributions. Either way, you can get to the path by accessing the sphere and vice-versa, but in my experience going directly for the one you want works a little better.

My bottom line is that if it works, it works. So try some of these different methods out and see for yourself which one works the best. Your results may differ from mine, since there's a lot of individual variation in magical operations.

Anonymous said...

The way i see it, each sephira or sphere is its own world and the planet ruling it represents only a part of it. As a comparison, the sphere is like a country with its history, traditions, habits and so on, and the ruling planet represents the state governing that country, with its laws, law enforcement, and all the other branches of a government. This could be why there's a general misunderstanding between the uses of Raphael and Michael with the Sun and Mercury. As i see it, Raphael is the archangel of Tiphareth, but the angel of the Sun is Michael. Likewise, Raphael is the angel of Hod, but the archangel is Michael. They could represent different entities or different sides of the same entity, just like with Carmara and Blumaza, but like you said, the angel is clever enough to know what you want and lets you get the appropriate entity for that specific work.

That being said, it makes sense to produce the planetary angels' sigils from the specific kamea, in order to pinpoint the exact entity you're willing to work with for that purpose.

Scott Stenwick said...

I think with Raphael and Michael you are dealing with separate entities, based on my interactions with them. Their attributions for Mercury and Sun just switch depending on whether you are working path or sphere. If you keep that distinction in mind, there's no confusion at all - which is one of the advantages of using it.

I suppose that observation would support the idea that Tzaphkiel and Cassiel are likewise separate entities, rather than a single entity with two aspects - if we are assuming that on the spiritual level, everything is logical and orderly. We need our systems to be logical and orderly to do magick effectively, but that doesn't mean the underlying reality is necessarily as neat or sensible.

Anonymous said...

You might be right. I'm also thinking there could be an archangel Raphael governing Tiphareth and a different angel also named Raphael being the angel of Mercury - the geomantic angel from 777. And with Michael it would be the same - archangel of Hod and a different angel of the Sun.

Scott Stenwick said...

That does not line up with my experience. As far as my interactions with them have gone, Raphael is Raphael and Michael is Michael. It just seems that they have different aspects depending on the context.

In fact, it could even be that this is the difference between an "archangel" and an "angel." Archangels can have multiple aspects, whereas regular angels cannot. In addition to the Sun/Mercury associations, Raphael corresponds to elemental air and Michael corresponds to elemental fire. Also Gabriel corresponds to both elemental water and the Moon.

Auriel seems to be the odd archangel out, though you could perhaps argue that as the archangel of elemental earth, Auriel's aspects span all four elements.

Anonymous said...

"In fact, it could even be that this is the difference between an "archangel" and an "angel." Archangels can have multiple aspects, whereas regular angels cannot."

That seems fair. I totally got your point now. Thanks :D

Anonymous said...

This would fit better in your other Saturn post, since you go through the entire hierarchy there.

Can one conjure the spirit of the geomes? I know that the planetary spirits rule over the corresponding geome(s), in this case Carcer and Tristitia, so I'm wondering if there geomes themselves are material representations of spirits.

Orion Silverstar 191 said...

Thanks for that article Scott, very interesting in deed. Is Saturn the same as Azazel/Zazel, as the both share the same seal? Does it matter if these types of workings are done in the day or night? Thanks for you time.

Scott Stenwick said...

@Dacia: Gnomes are the servitors of the King of Earth, so are not really attributed to Saturn. The ritual you would use to summon them would be more like my Elemental Work -Earth ritual. When you conjure the King, you can call upon him to bring forth the Gnomes if you wish to work with them directly. Then, you can command them by the name of the King.

@Orion: First off, I'm not convinced that Zazel and Azazel are the same spirit.

But if you're talking about Zazel, the Spirit of Saturn, you could use a ritual similar to this one. Instead of conjuring the angel, you would conjure the Intelligence, Agiel, and then call upon Zazel by the name of the Intelligence. You can call upon the Intelligence on its own, but when conjuring the Spirit you must call upon them both. Otherwise you get a blind force which is difficult to manage, let alone command. You also need to draw the sigils of both upon the character of Saturn, rather than the sigil of the Angel.

According to the tradition, day hours and night hours both will work fine for magical operations. I have theorized that perhaps certain types of operations work better during the day, and others work better during the night, but I don't have much in the way of data to support that. The rituals I've done, regardless of intent, seem to work fine as long as the hour is correct and there's not much difference between my day versus night results.

Anonymous said...

I think there was a misunderstanding. I meant geomes as in figures of geomancy, not gnomes :) Crowley even wrote a poem about them http://gleamingsfromthedawn.blogspot.ro/2009/07/aleister-crowleys-geomantic-mnemonic.html?m=0

I found that the planetary spirits rule over the corresponding geome, or geomes. In this case Zazel over Carcer and Tristitia. So I thought the geomes themselves could have a certain spirit behind them which could be conjured.

Scott Stenwick said...

Oh, okay. Sorry about that. As far as the signs of geomancy go, Crowley did define a list of geomantic intelligences, including the angels of the planets (such as Cassiel here). But I haven't done a lot of work with the geomantic signs in my personal practice.

It makes sense that a spirit or spirits would be attributed to them. Is the attribution for Zazel from your own work, or something that you found elsewhere?

Anonymous said...

I think I found their attributions in Agrippa some time ago, or at least in an article that quoted from Agrippa. But I can't find it right now :( I only found this link and it looks like besides the geomes being ruled by the planetary spirits, they are also attributed genii, which are the corresponding geomantic intelligences of the zodiac signs.

http://www.esotericonline.net/m/group/discussion?id=3204576%3ATopic%3A770262

I also found a few articles way back before I actually started practicing magick, in which the authors detailed the conjuration of geomes. I didn't understand any of that back then :))

Scott Stenwick said...

777 has a list of them too, but it associates Carcer with Capricorn and Tristitia with Aquarius. Both signs are ruled by Saturn, but relating them to the spirit of Saturn is a more indirect association than I would personally use.

Under that system, the geomantic intelligence of Carcer would be Hanael and the geomantic intelligence for Tristitia would be Cambriel. That's the method that I would use if I wanted to contact the spirit associated with a geome.

Once I get done with the planets, I'll be moving on to the zodiac - so those rituals will be showing up here once I get to that point.

Anonymous said...

It does seem more appropriate for them to be associated with the geomagnetic intelligences of the zodiac signs rather than the spirits of the planets. It'll take some time before I'll begin experimenting with conjuring the geomes, but I'll share my findings then.

Beautiful series btw!

Anonymous said...

I should have asked this in the first place, but i keep forgetting :)

Is it necessary to add the black circle of protection when casting curses with this updated style ritual? (I'm suspecting so)

Forgot to mention this before. Earlier this summer I did a series of Mars curses with Bartzabel - the target experienced a series of health issues but that's all, because I told the spirit not to go for the kill. I cast several curses because i had no link. Due to the small practice space, I had to construct a small black circle, enough for me to fit into it (about 4feet wide). I don't know whether I accidentally moved a part of my body outside the circle after calling down the spirit, or because the first time I called him I accidentally allowed the divine light to descend into my circle after the GIRH of Mars (Bartzabel was instructed to go into the triangle after I called Graphiel), but a few weeks later I burned my hand with boiling water.

It was nothing that couldn't be fixed with a little magick and some aloe ointment (the Moon really tempers down Mars also he he), but i got the message.

Scott Stenwick said...

The black circle is not for protection. It is to focus your mind upon the sphere of Saturn during your operation, and you can use it if you want with this ritual, but it is not necessary.

The piece you want for protection is the Table of Art, which contains the triangle. For a small space, I don't recommend trying to build a physical circle at all, as the dimensions make this challenging. As long as your target is within the triangle, you are shielded from any potential effects of casting a curse.

The magical forms themselves create a sort of "astral circle," and I have found that this usually is sufficient for just about any sort of operation. This isn't only a modern idea - Jake Stratton-Kent reports that visualized or astral circles have been used dating back to antiquity, and I trust his research.

Anonymous said...

Oh, so I guess then my accident was the result of the energy of multiple Mars curses combined with working the path of Mars a few days apart.

Scott Stenwick said...

Or it was just a regular accident that had nothing to do with your operations. Those happen to magicians too, after all, and not all of them have anything to do with the magick we happen to be working at the time.

Anonymous said...

I guess this is the best place for asking the following question, since Saturn has more chthonic attributes than other planets.

I have worked a few times with chthonic spirits, but mostly for my own benefit or for more curse related actions. Right now I'm thinking of experimenting with them to aid someone, due to their blunt approach to making the intent manifest - if they don't play tricks that is :)

The question is about the way I should use the link in the ritual. I don't think it's a good idea to place it outside the protected area so it would directly be subjected to those energies. I'm the other hand I think leaving the link inside the circle would diminish the chances for success. Any ideas?

Scott Stenwick said...

If you are using a containment structure, the link needs to go inside it so the spirit you are conjuring can interact with it. If you put it outside the Table of Art, your ritual will not work nearly as well.

The link creates a non-local connection to the target, and its presence in the containment structure allows the spirit to connect with the target through it. It doesn't make any difference whether you are casting a curse or a protective operation, the tech remains the same.

Anonymous said...

You're right. I had to get over some latent misconceptions :) I will simply leave the link outside of the circle and call the spirit to apear before the circle, as in Jason Miller's Bune ritual. Thanks for clearing that for me!

Scott Stenwick said...

You should never just do that. Always use a containment structure. If you want to conjure a spirit outside the circle, you need to set up a triangle and so forth. Then you put your link inside the triangle into which you call the spirit.

Most of the time, though, I work with my containment structure inside the circle, in the center of my altar. I find that's easier to deal with, and I haven't had any issues even when working with cthonics in that way.

Anonymous said...

So basically it's the same as a planetary ritual for instance, only the Operant Field would be followed by the conjuration of the spirit inside the triangle using the name of the corresponding angel and various other names of power. It makes sense! :D Thank you!

Anonymous said...

I'm going to ask this one here, since I've already asked you about demons above.

Do you use the demon attributions to the signs according to 777 in your work? I'm only asking this because various sources attribute several demons to different signs.

I'm mostly going with the 777 attributions found here, but I wonder what would happen if somehow Crowley got some of them wrong and I end up conjuring them with names of power other than that of the sign, the angel of the decan and so on. I'm not concerned about my safety, but whether they would show up or not.

http://www.thelemapedia.org/index.php/Tree_of_Life:Infernals

Scott Stenwick said...

I probably am not the best person to ask, since I rarely work with those attributions. If you try to conjure a spirit by the totally name, ceremonial form, and so forth, it won't show up. It's like tuning your radio to the wrong frequency.

I do know Goetic magicians who use those attributions and report good results. Those attributions come right out of the Lemegeton, and Kenneth Grant's whole Typhonian system is based on those attributions of the Qlippoth (from Liber 231). So I expect that they work, for what that's worth.

Anonymous said...

I've had a few successes using these attributions. When I call one of them I do it by the permutation of the sign they're in, by the name of the angel ruling over them and i recently added the names of the angel of the specific decan, as well as the Egyptian name of the decan. They showed up so far, and they didn't seem annoyed by my method. I didn't threaten them and such, just simply asked them to show up inside the triangle using those specific names, after the Operant Field, Bornless One invocation and a call to my angel.

Thanks for the answer!

Unknown said...

Hi Dacia ¡¡

I love the method of poke runyon is the most consistent for me is direct, clear and extremely powerful very fast, that if I use the table trithemio instead of the formal triangle, In this case the idea of opening Yesod with the heptagram and then activating the appropriate sphere within that Tree is simply fantastic, in fact from that model you could work very intensely on the plane of Yesod

Scott Stenwick said...

My first rule is that if it works for you it works, so keep that in mind with respect to the following.

Model-wise, though, my issue with Runyon's method is that he uses the LBRP followed immediately by the invoking heptagram of the planet. That's the same as LBRP/GIRH. The issue is that in my experience, without the LIRH what you wind up getting is a microcosmic manifestation, or something weighted strongly in that direction. So you generally have more problems separating your thoughts from those of the spirit and so forth.

That might not be as much of a problem for you, and as I said, if it works go ahead and keep doing it. It might not work the same way for me as it does for everyone.

Anonymous said...

Good point Scott. Poke Runyon's youtube video from 1995 (I think) made me want to start learning about and practicing magick back before I got into it.

I remember he performed a reenactment of a ritual for conjuring Astarte-Astaroth both as a goddess and a demon form. I also remember he worked with Netzach of Yesod.

But I find his system to be a bit too complicated for me and I also don't understand why he called the goddess both in the form of an all powerful being and in that of "a part of the deep mind" aka demon.

Whenever I work with Lilith for instance, I do it the pagan way, addressing the goddess herself, without refering to her in some way that would point towards the demonized traits she had been attributed over the ages.

Whenever I work with a chthonic spirit, I do it by calling the names of the celestial hierarchy above them, somewhat similar to when I would call a planetary spirit, say Chasmodai. But without calling the archangel and intelligence, only using the names of power in the conjuration.

But as Scott said, if it works for you, that's great!

Anonymous said...

Come to think about it, I remember he had bound the "part of the deep mind" and only engaged the goddess in conversation.

But I see no reason for doing that, even when using his system. If he located Astarte as being in Netzach and wanted to work with her in Yesod, I see no reason why he didn't simply call upon her without previously binding the "demonic" part. In my opinion refering to an ancient god as a demon simply because some ill intended people in the past turned gods into demons for their own agenda is an insult to that god.

My ritual with Lilith goes like this: Operant Field - initial invocation - MP (optional) - addressing my angel for assistance - prayers to call upon the goddess - conversation or whatever - giving thanks and asking(!) her to depart - LBRP/QC.

Scott Stenwick said...

The whole idea that demons are part of whatever the "deep mind" is supposed to be is in my opinion basically wrong. First off, the unconscious is mostly a collection of conditioning loops, so it's more like a simple machine than anything we normally call a mind. Second, it implies that you're not working with an external consciousness at all, but rather some sort of psychological projection. Maybe Runyon sees the deity as some kind of external entity, but if so, it seems to me that worrying about the "deep mind" aspect doesn't make much sense. The macrocosm always includes the microcosm, pretty much by definition.

Anonymous said...

That too! Even if he would've considered demons to be spirits with their own consciousness and personality, I see no reason why he needed to call upon Astaroth. Then he would bind the spirit. And only then would he call upon Astarte. I remember that in the video I mentioned, he asked Astarte to forgive them for constraining her, but they were only doing that to the part of her representing some part of their deep mind. Or something :)) Way too many twists and turns for me, especially since this whole ritual is done after accessing a sephira of another sephira.

javier said...

Perhaps it would be very interesting to realize the operant field and then to prove the rite of the heptagram as for these spirits I have done, of course the operant field elevates the quality of the ritual as you say Scott

Scott Stenwick said...

Sure, there is nothing particularly wrong with the Heptagram ritual for planets. With the operant field, LBRP/LIRH/Heptagram of Planet should produce the same effect as LBRP/LIRH/GIRH for Planet. My only objection to Runyon's sequence is that he omits the Lesser Hexagram and jumps straight to the Heptagram. I would have the same objection to LBRP/GIRH for Planet.

javier said...

Hi Scott ¡¡

Of course the operant field is vital already in my practice, it is perhaps or that you comment opens new ways to practice Goetia without a doubt.
Perhaps when working with the sphere of the Moon, the hexagram-macrocosmos is not considered necessary, Scott thinks that your idea is to ascend to Thipareth, and from there open the lunar rooms, where the demons or other spirits dwell, which is very powerful If you understand the magic logic,And of course the work with the heptagram may be interesting, maybe I will only do this for the Goetia practice

Scott Stenwick said...

The hexagram-macrocosmos is never necessary, as long as you are working within the microcosmic realm. To get any sort of practical effect that doesn't just involve changing your psychology and/or behavior, though, your operation needs to affect the macrocosm - period.

That's not to say microcosmic rituals can't be powerful. They can be. The key is to understand the domain of the forces you're working with in the context of your ritual, and not to confuse the planes as you go.

Fr. V.e.L.V.X said...

I believe the bottom two rows of the kamea should be 3-5-7, 8-1-6.

Scott Stenwick said...

This one is fixed now. Note that the difference does affect the shape of the second sigil, the one that I don't personally use. If you did try out both, you might want to check again just to make sure it didn't skew your results.

Closedaccount said...

Still performing and educating myself about this, for me i just need to read this and focus real on this that i can feel it all like it was a ritual, exta sensitive i guess.

Also was with a feeling that got any bad energy at my neck pressing me and instantly gonne out.

While writing this got a spider that came downed from roof to my chest, see them a lot, guess some energy on me is atracking them :s

Bishop said...

Dear Scott,

I recently started reading this site and i like it very much.
Could you clarify some thing for me.
When constructing a sigil do i make the same sigil 4 times with same sings just with different coresponding colour for each kabalistic world?

Can i make Table od Art on paper and a marker?

Can i ude just LBRP and LIRH on begining?

Is it a good idea to make a circle od salt around Table of Art?

Once i start making ritual for hexagram i don t continue with keyword analysis i go to recite Orphic Hymn?

Sorry for long post i wanna to be carefull with this things ?

Scott Stenwick said...

When constructing a sigil, it is left to your own devices how you paint or color it. Crowley recommended using all four colors, but sometimes I will just draw it in the "natural" color for what I am trying to do (King Scale for paths, Queen Scale for sephiroth) and that seems to work fine.

Yes, you can draw a Table of Art on paper with a marker. Or find an image online and print it out. Both of those methods work.

LBRP/LIRH are fine for opening your ritual. That's how I do it.

I never have bothered with a circle of salt, but if you want to do it, it probably won't hurt anything.

When I open with LBRP/LIRH, I consider the Keyword Analysis "done" when I get to the Greater Ritual of the Hexagram because I already did it with the LIRH. So I don't generally use the Keyword Analysis with the GIRH, I just trace the hexagrams to the directions.

I've found over the years that the Orphic Hymn can be skipped unless you particularly like it - if you do, by all means keep using it. The way I do it, when I use it, is to read it right after the GIRH, which as I said above I don't usually do with the Keyword Analysis.

You probably don't need to be as careful as you are being. This kind of magick doesn't "blow up" or "backfire" or any of that horror movie nonsense. The worst that's likely to happen if you do things "wrong" is that your ritual just won't do anything. There's a considerable amount of flexibility in the forms and components.

Bishop said...

Thanks for answering

I just wanna be sure with this:
When i draw a planetary sigil of planet and sing of a spirit they are the same as on another sigils.Just all other sigils have different colours to affect all 4 kabalistic worlds ?(So they are 4 sigils inside Table of Art)

And can i make sigils with markers when i colour them?

Could Bornless rite be used to "manifestation"or some contact to make iz more efficient ?

Scott Stenwick said...

No, it would be one sigil that incorporates all four colors. You would not want to create four separate sigils.

Yes, you can use markers. That's what I usually do.

The Bornless Rite can be added to this ritual if you want. I have only done a couple of experiments adding it and those worked well, but I don't have enough of a sample set to say for sure how much it improves the effectiveness of operations.

In the template here, the Bornless Rite would follow the Middle Pillar/Elevenfold Seal and precede "Thee I invoke who art Universe!"

Bishop said...

I m sorry for being boring but how would a sigil look where all 4 colours are there incorporated in one sigil?Is there a colour one on another or we got 4 squares on one sigil?

After the operation what do i do with sigils ?If you destroy sigil would a spirit be angry or you could use it for next operation ?
If i decide to keep it do i need a special place for it because energy in a sigil could interfere with living space ?

There s no price to pay to angels or spirit if they do something for us right.


Scott Stenwick said...

I am missing something here about the four squares you are talking about. I am not sure what you mean.

It could be as simple as drawing four colored lines right next to each other so it's one line but. Or if you are making a kamea sigil like I do here, you can do something like this:

Cassiel is spelled Kaph-Shin-Yod-Aleph-Lamed and the four colors are Indigo, Black, Blue-Black, and Black Rayed Blue.

1. Draw the small circle and the first portion of the line, from Kaph (20 -> 2) to Shin (300 -> 3), in indigo marker.

2. Draw the second portion of the line, from Shin (300 -> 3) to Yod (10 -> 1) in black marker.

3. Draw the third portion of the line, from Yod (10 -> 1) to Aleph (1) - hence the little "jag" between the points in the square for 1 - in both black and blue marker. That is, draw in black and go over the line in blue or vice versa.

4. Draw the fourth portion of line, from Aleph (1) to Lamed (30 -> 3) as a line alternating blue and black. That is, draw a dotted line in black and then fill in the gaps between dots with blue or vice versa. Also draw the vertical line that ends the sigil this way.

So there's nothing mysterious or confusing or difficult about it. You can draw it fine with black, blue, and indigo (purple works fine for indigo) markers. There's also a lot of flexibility around this, so feel free to experiment - just like you would in an art class. Feel free to devise your own way of doing this.

You can keep using the sigil for other operations. The sigil itself is not a talisman that holds some sort of magical energy or whatnot - it's more like a "phone number" for conjuring the angel, if that makes sense. So destroying won't affect the angel in any way, and you can keep it wherever you want.

You can make offerings to angels. Some people do that in advance, other people stipulate that when a task is performed they will make an offering of some sort. So the latter is a little like making a payment. But there's not much evidence that there's much of a difference in effectiveness between offerings given before or offerings given after.

But if you are asking if there's some "price" above and beyond any "deal" you actively decide to make with the angel in return for its services, the answer is no.

Bishop said...

OOO thank you,

I was thinking it was desinged like talisman.Now i know i just draw Sephirot Binah with all its paths surounding it like a piece of Tree od Life ?

I got a feel that this magick is effective and awesome.

Have you ever called Gods like Hermes and Aphrodite and made offerings to them ?Just a idea.




Scott Stenwick said...

I suppose you could draw Binah like that if you wanted. This ritual does not require it. You want the kamea sigil, drawn exactly as above but with the four colors as I explained. That's all you need to summon Cassiel.

I've gotten a lot of success with this Agrippa planetary magick system over the years. I like it too.

As a Thelemite I'm more likely to work with the Egyptian pantheon, but I have done offerings and the like for Horus, Hathor, Tahuti, and a number of other related deities. I also am an ordained EGC priest and have performed the Gnostic Mass many times, which works with Nuit, Hadit, and Ra-Hoor-Khuit - the principle deities from The Book of the Law.

Bishop said...

https://luxsaturni.com/planetary-magic/saturn/
Above in link the inteligence and spirit od Saturn are different then in this article.
When i do sigils and add Inteligence and spirit on Google it shows different sigils then here.So i would like to ask can i use the one here when making a sigil and words,removing the vowels etc.

Scott Stenwick said...

The sigils of the intelligence and spirit on the site are the ones I would use. I am not sure where the Cassiel sigil comes from - it must be some other source with angel sigils that are not generated using the magic square. Some of those are out there - for example, there is a document called the magical calendar that has sigils for most of the zodiacal angels because the ones I use are created using magic squares and the others are from some other source compiled in Agrippa that then made it into the magical calendar. Spirits can have more than one sigil, if that's what you're wondering about.

Otherwise I really don't get your question. Of course I think you can use these sigils. They're the ones that I personally use for planetary magick, which is why I have them posted here. I can't vouch for every other site out on the Internet, but I wouldn't deliberately post something that I knew was wrong - that would be stupid. If I didn't want the information available I wouldn't publish it.

Desmond G. said...

Hello Scott, thank you very much for sharing knowledge. I'm improving my magic techniques thanks to your posts.
Just a question. For example when I invoke saturn (with the hexagram of invocation of saturn starting at the top and clockwise ...) + Magical intention, I always add the hexagram of saturn in the form of banishing to close the portal. It's right?
For example
LBRP + LIRH + MD + Hexagram of invoking saturn + Magical intention (For example: break the black magic) + Hexagram of banishing of saturn + LBRP.

Thank you ;)

Scott Stenwick said...

I do not use the banishing hexagram of Saturn. As I see it, the invoking hexagram of Saturn tunes the space to an environment favorable to the spirit, you call the spirit with the conjuration, deliver the charge, and dismiss the spirit with the license to depart. There is no need to banish anything after that - in fact, banishing Saturn afterwards can in some cases (but not all) interfere with your charge.

Instead, I just close with the LBRP to detach my sphere of sensation from whatever I just conjured up. That "lets it loose" on the world, so to speak. Traditional Golden Dawn does involve symmetrical invoking and banishing (where you do the banishing hexagram of the planet you invoked after the charge) but I find my operations work a lot better without it.

Desmond G. said...

Thank you very much for your complete and effective answer.

Bishop said...

What would be a difference to make a offering to a God for example Saturn and calling Saturnian entities to do something ?
Is the result smiliar.

Scott Stenwick said...

Personally I find that calling entities works better. But as always, feel free to experiment. Your findings might be different than mine.

Bishop said...

Can I do offerings of some things like alcohol spontaneously for some entity like Mercury ?I pour for example alcohol on someday in the name of entity.(Will some things generally work for me better generally without giving a charge for example Mercurian entities
will at certain time give me better communication or make travel more easy ).This is just for honoring not telling a charge.


Scott Stenwick said...

I would suggest experimenting with that to see if you start getting noticeably better results. An offering like that won't be as effective as doing a full ritual, but it probably will also have some effect greater than zero. It's hard for me to guess exactly where it would fall within that range.

I'd say it could very well be worth trying out, though.

Bishop said...

I called Sachiel and made a sigil to use it as a talisman and put it into a Table of Art but after I done a ritual I have seen Cassiel s Sigil on Saturn kamea on it drawned (did n t see was in a hurry)
My question is will Cassiel s sigil have some effect on operation.
The sigil of Sachiel was made on Jupiter kamea and of paper and put on Cassiel s sigil that was alredy drawned
inside a circle.

Scott Stenwick said...

I am not sure I understand exactly what happened here. So, you had a piece of paper with Cassiel's name on the Saturn kamea and left it in your table of art, but then drew up another piece of paper with Sachiel's name on the Jupiter kamea and put it in the table of art without taking the first piece of paper out?

I haven't done this myself so I can't say for sure. In theory, the sigil is like a "phone number" for the spirit and if you only conjured Sachiel, you should still get only Sachiel. That would be my best guess, but follow the operation and see how it works.

Bishop said...

I did the version just wandered should I incorporate God of Path calling or I do all that when I recite the Orphyc Hymn ?

Scott Stenwick said...

1. You do the Greater Invoking Ritual of the Hexagram with AB as the godname.
2. Then you recite the Orphic Hymn.
3. Then you recite the conjuration. You call on Cassiel by AB, Agiel by Cassiel, and Zazel by Agiel.

That's the process outlined here. Is one of those steps what you mean by the "God of Path calling?"

Bishop said...

No I meant what happens if I do:
"AB,AB,AB come to me God of Path of Saturn.Send me Cassiel ,Angel of Path of Saturn"
And so forth.
Or I did already some kind of God form Assumption with Orphyc Hymn.

Scott Stenwick said...

No, you do not do that. I mean, I suppose you could and it wouldn't hurt anything, but it's not necessary and I don't think it would improve your results.

It actually is the Greater Ritual of the Hexagram (not the Orphic Hymn) that tunes the space to the godname. After that, you don't need to call on the godname again.

Luis said...

Hey Scott, I'm trying to find positive uses for the malefics and I've had good results in working with Mars to burn down limitations, illusions, essentially think of it as the Tower card in tarot.
Now, I've always seen Saturn as a black hole that decays everything one throws at it. Do you think it would be a good idea to call on Saturn as a means to destroy all the evil that resides within? With evil essentially representing the fears, doubts, and limitations that keep us short of realizing our goals?

Scott Stenwick said...

You do need to be careful working with the idea of evil, because it is not that well defined except in relation to good. If you are talking about using Saturn to remove limitations and restrictions that keep you from reaching your goals, that definitely is a workable application. I think I would just state it like that in ritual, though, instead of bringing the idea of evil into it.

Alex Scaraoschi said...

Yea based on Zalewski' book on GD stuff evil is when a lower plane ascends to a higher one and tries to corrupt it - i.e. the Qliphoth into Malkuth. That has nothing to do with what people in general consider to be evil.

Bishop said...

What entity would you recommend for information about hidden things like Gold,Jewerly etc?

There s a story near me or maybe a myth when one man in a near village hid small amount of gold!So I guessed I could call entities to know the exact location if there s any!I guess is the Sun!

When doing Liber Samekh it logical to do a Macrocosmic version like tracing the hexagrams instead of Spirit and Elemental Pentagrams !
Just asking what appropriate hexagrams woud be?

Scott Stenwick said...

You could ask several of them. Saturn rules underworld things, so if the treasure was buried you might have luck there. Sun is good for straight-up acquiring wealth. Also Mercury is good for information and knowledge of secrets.

If you wanted to do a macrocosmic version of Samekh I would recommend the elemental hexagrams from the Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram. I haven't tried that myself, but if you do let me know how it goes. I'd be interested to hear if you get any surprising results.

El Barto said...

Dear Scott:

First and foremost, thank you for your great contribution, the information you provide has been of paramount help in my personal practice.

Recently, I plunged into planetary magick for the first time with incredible, yet very strange results (I guess that's why they call it magick).

Last Saturday, I performed your ritual for the invocation of Saturn, not to curse someone, but to free someone from such influences.

Somehow, I forgot to include the preliminary invocation after the Middle Pillar. Somewhere during the following steps I realized that and I felt it just deflated my concentration and enthusiasm (I'm sure you know the feeling). However, after I vibrated the names of Cassiel and its associates for the last time, I perceived a clear note of sulphur in the air, which really surprised me, to say the least.

Given the concealed nature of both the sickness and the remedy, so to speak, I gave the spirits a week time frame to show me an "ineffable sign" of the accomplishment of the task.

As soon as I left my apartment, the synchronicities started, which reminded me of my early trials with chaos magick.

So, although I have shaken off the feeling of having performed the ritual incorrectly to a certain degree, I don´t seem to be able to get completely rid of it, despite the sulphur and stuff.

Tell me what are your thoughts and experiences on the corroboration of results.

Thanks again for all your awesome work.

93 93/93

Scott Stenwick said...

The Middle Pillar can work as a preliminary invocation on its own. I often just use that or the Elevenfold Seal on its own and skip that step - so I doubt that would be your problem. I also do work with Cassiel regularly for protection and the like and have not had any issues, even though Saturn is supposed to be a malefic.

The spirits are giving you signs - any synchronicity can be a sign. I rarely ask for anything like that because it seems like a waste of power to me. The spirits can (A) produce the results and (B) give me signs, or (A) produce the result. If (C) is the total amount of power available, with the first option your final outcome will be (A) - (B), which will always be greater than (A). But you asked for signs, and you are getting synchronicities.

Did the operation succeed in accomplishing your objective?

If stuff is hanging around from a ritual, you can use the LBRP/LBRH combination to shut it down. That's basically the "full reset." You can repeat the license to depart before you do that to make sure the spirits know to clear out before you blast your space.

El Barto said...

I have to admit I would have never thought of that! Thank you for your insight! I did it mostly because I guess curses are trickier to spot than let's say wealth or whatever...

Did the operation suceed in accomplishing my objective?

Well, the day you posted your comment I received a new sign. A very chthonic one. BUT yesterday, out of the blue, this person told us how the night before she was lying on her stomach, sleeping and then she felt like something grabbed her by the back and shook her. I asked her again about the position she was sleeping in. She was positive she was lying on her belly. Why did I asked that? Because one of the lines in my injunction read: "remove any parasitic entity FROM HER BACK". I had to order a bottle of wine, you know...

So, if that is not "ineffable" I don't know what is.

Today, as I was going through my daily practice, sensed a note of sulphur in the incense fumes. I guess the ritual had come full circle...

Thank you, Scott

93 93/93

Samat said...

I have a question about Saturn's application towards a problem, specifically about overcoming limitations.

Say my country experiences severe gas loadsheddings every Winter, would a Saturn talismanic operation to reverse this in the month of Capricorn work for oneself?

What practical result would occur with this Saturn operation?

Or, what would you go for?

Scott Stenwick said...

Saturn could work like that, to remove limitations on gas availability. You could also work with Jupiter to increase the effective supply. Or maybe even both, as long as you do separate independent workings.

Ravenn said...

Hi Scott

Recently a nagging thought has entered my head and I'm not sure if it has come from something I read or a spirit trying to answer a question I had... I'll try and keep this succinct here

I am a newbie, starting out, and have had minor successes (by my POV) with magickal operations thus far. I've done about 15 rituals for talismans and 2 or 3 rituals anchored to myself. Daily ritual practices for well over a year, consistently. Perhaps I am still too new to be that effective, but I wondered if something else was hindering things. That's when this idea came to me, especially reading this article.

Saturn, in my natal chart, is right on my Ascendant point conjunct Mercury. Currently, Solar Arc Saturn is conjunct Pluto. Obviously, Saturn is playing an enormous part in my astrological landscape here and--I would assume--will be an energy that dampens everything I do, including magickal operations. First question: is this idea correct? Am I on target with this assumption?

So in thinking about this...I got the image of trying to paddle upstream rather than go WITH the current around the bend. Meaning, all my operations with The Sun, Venus, Jupiter, Mercury, and The Moon will have a weakened quality to it because of Saturn's current influence. So my second question is: if the First question is true...then would I need to/be better served by performing a ritual/operation for Saturn that LIMITS it's affect on me and my life?

And my final question is: if I am correct with the first two...and an operation to lessen Saturn's influence over me would help greatly...HOW would you suggest I phrase that charge/limitation in order to best achieve that? (out of curiosity)

Hopefully this makes sense. Thank you Scott and hope you're well sir!

Scott Stenwick said...

You could create a Saturn talisman using the methods in The Planetary Work - Saturn post and charge it with limiting Saturn's negative effects on you stemming from its position in your chart. Make sure you charge it with limiting negative effects, because you want to keep all the positive Saturn qualities that you can.

It's hard to say if your Saturn position is the sole explanation for your results, but it could at least be a contributing factor. In your situation I probably would go ahead and make such a talisman and see if my results improved. You will want to anchor it on a talisman because this would be intended to be an ongoing, long-term effect.

Ravenn said...

Okay yea this is what I was thinking would be best. Not linking it to myself but rather a piece of lead or onyx. Based off of what you suggested, Saturn is on my Ascendant heavily influencing ME...Capricorn is intercepted in the 5th which is romantic relationships, and Aquarius has domain of the 6th and 7th. Solar Arc Saturn conjuncts natal Pluto in the 2nd while Solar Arc Pluto squares natal Saturn in the 1st from the 4th. There is loss everywhere.

So since the 4th to the 7th is heavily dominated and taking loss here, the charge I have drawn up for Saturnian spirits is as follows:

"Great and powerful Cassiel, Agiel, and Zazel...I command thee by the power of Adonai to Limit the negative and deteriorating effects of Saturnian influences over all my relationships; personal, familial, romantic, and business while continuing to maintain all positive influences to support and assist them, allowing no physical injury and or death to occur."

I think that would cover all the negative effects thus far stemming from the chart. Other factors obviously would be influenced like money, etc. But I think ANOTHER talisman would need to be made to focus on the specifics of THAT category. I think breaking down the arenas that Saturn is affecting and linking those categorically to talismans MAY keep things from getting "diluted" if I apply it all to just ONE talisman.

I may not be able to get my hands on the appropriate incense as no one seems to sell the "foul odors" variety though lol.

Scott Stenwick said...

Your charge there is fine except that Ab is the godname for the path of Saturn, not Adonai. You want to use the correct godname in your charge, and you should use Ab rather than YHVH Elohim because this is a talisman for working on practical matters, not for mystical realization.

You can make other related talismans if you want, but I don't know that you will necessarily need them. Probably give this first one a try, see how it works, and based on those results decide if you want to make additional ones. At least, that would be my approach.

I have asthma so I rarely use incense, and my operations work fine. Don't worry if you can't find something that seems appropriate, just go ahead with making your talisman.

Ravenn said...

Thank you, this works great actually

So to clarify something, when making a Planetary kamea, like those you have on your lessons...what EXACTLY is getting the four colors? Are we including the Character or are we just using the four colors on the SIGIL of the ANGEL?

Because from my interpretation, this is the structure of how I made all of mine: I copied the FINAL one into a paint program and lightened the textures to be a light gray. I printed them out at a 4x4 inch size and the traced the box in black marker and also traced all the CHARACTERS in black marker too. For the sigils, THAT'S where I did the four colored markers. Should the entirety of it all be colored in or just the sigil?

And I am assuming it is "more potent" to actually color it in with marker, physically, than to just "paint" them in a paint program and print them out too, correct?

Scott Stenwick said...

This does not necessarily need to be done with perfect precision. I have varied the method over the years from time to time and it seems like unless certain qualifiers are not met, the method still works.

You don't necessarily need all four colors. The sigil will work fine if you just draw it using what I call the "natural color" associated with it. For the paths, that would be the King Scale color. For the sephiroth, that would be the Queen Scale color. You match those colors by Key Scale in Liber 777.

For Saturn, the path color is indigo and the sephira color is black.

I color the entire image, both the character/seal and the sigil. You do not need to color the numbers on the kamea or the grid, or even include them. I include the grids in mine just to ensure the proper positioning of the sigil.

You are correct that you need to draw over the images, not just print them out on a computer. My experiments with computer printouts did not work nearly as well - there's something about the hand-drawing process that is important for these operations. You also should draw over them in the proper planetary hour, because that makes a difference as well. It doesn't matter when you print them out, only when you color over them.

Ravenn said...

Okay that makes sense. I had previously done them on a computer before during their appropriate day/hour and "painted" them with the mouse...they SEEMED to work but from what I'm gathering, the hand-inked method works BETTER.

Now, do I need to do these in the planetary hour AND the day, or just he planetary hour and whatever day that happens to be convenient?

And size-wise, what dimensions are we looking for? Typically I made my 3" inches square. I printed out the ToA that you have on all of the articles here and simply printed that out too on cardstock. It's about 7.5" I'd say. When I lay the sigil on top of the ToA I try to get it as close to the middle as I can and if I have an object used for linking, or a talisman, I make sure to lay it on top of the sigil where it covers the triangle on the ToA. I also put the candle within the ToA too, near the top as well as any small containers for offerings. It gets kind of cramped lol.

Scott Stenwick said...

I have never tried that with a mouse - I would not be able to make anything look good like that anyway. Pretty sure you will find the hand-inked version is best.

I like to ink mine in both the day and hour, but according to grimoire sources the hour is more important so it can be done on any day as long as the hour is right.

As far as size goes, nothing is really specified. It should fit inside your Table of Practice, but otherwise can be as large or as small as you like. You can go smaller with your sigil if your setup feels cramped and that should not affect the strength of your ritual.

Samat said...

Raven, I've just tried the printout method a few weeks ago. I did not have the privilege to print out the sigil during the hour but I did it on the day and I cut out the talisman during the hour of the operation, so I'm just waiting for the results.

As for rituals that worked, I drew by hand Scott's elemental sigils and they've so far worked fine mostly. My table of art is also habd drawn over a year ago. I used Trithemius ' version rather than the far more elaborate one on digital ambler.

Ravenn said...

Samat, thank you for letting me know...what I've done is copied all the sigils into a paint program, turned down the opacity until they were light, light gray and have been inking them with markers in the appropriate day/hour. They're all 3.25" x 3.25". Please let us know how the talisman one ends up working out.

I have used printed out ones before, inked in the appropriate day/hour but with a mouse and in the paint program and they SEEMED to work. Most of the rituals have actuated or--at the very least--shifted probabilities that have been noticeable now that the time limit I set has expired.

It seemed to run on some sort of curve...the ritual wasn't bound to a talisman but myself and had 4 weeks to run through. It started out hot, and stayed steady until the third week where it showed signs of slowing down. This past week and ran completely out of steam. (Yesterday was the final day). I'm thinking the timeline idea is less: "Okay, spell is running for 4 weeks? EVERY DAY is going to be firing on all cylinders!" and more "Here's a general time to begin to shift probabilities around...when it clicks, it clicks and things can wind down..."

But....one's mileage may vary!

Bishop said...

Can Saturn take away someone s energy ,make a narcistic person unable to influence his enviroment ih psychological sense ?
I don t want to make person suffer or throw a curse ,but isolate his negative influence and make him unimportant or almost invisible!It seems to me that Saturn could weaken his negativity by making him more tired!

Scott Stenwick said...

It probably will not make them unable to do anything, but Saturn absolutely should work for making them less able - that is, limit their ability to cause trouble whether or not that ability can be completely eliminated.

Virgo also works for invisibility, and you can cast it on another person. Again, it won't "really" make them invisible, but it will make it harder for other people to notice them and pay attention to them.

Samat said...

Now you mentioned it, can Virgo be asked to do the opposite of invisibility? That is to make you visible according to a situation you require. This could be, to have your entire case be more visible when applying for jobs from the start to the end with a limitation to hide the negative attributes. I mean it's the zodiacs. These guys go extremely hard.

Bishop said...

Yes,i did m t mean invisible in psychical sense ,more in a sense that a target has trouble influencing !

Have you tried PGM or exercises from Greek Papyrus?
I done some recently like Hymn to Hidden Stele to help faciliate contact with my HGA,and it feel very weird while i doing it along Liber Samekh.

Bishop said...

Maybe Angel of Capicron is more suited with depleting energy ,making someone less influental !
The "Evil Eye "can have many variations i guess ,for example that someone s instinctual anger or abuse can be thrown back at him!

Alex Scaraoschi said...

Or you can work with the Sun to destroy their egomaniacal ways.

Scott Stenwick said...

@Samat: Yes, angels of the zodiac run on sphere of influence just like planets. So Virgo can increase or decrease invisibility - that is, make someone or something more or less visible.

@Bishop: No, I am not familiar with those exercises. Capricorn, though, can definitely be effective for draining/limiting energy. Its sphere of influence is energy work in general. It can also protect from "evil eye" style curses in addition to casting them.

@Alex: Yes, Sun can be used to increase or decrease egotistical behavior. Again, sphere of influence.

The big takeaway from all these questions is that both planets and signs can either increase or decrease anything that they rule over. And this has numerous useful magical applications once you really get it down.

Alex Scaraoschi said...

"...both planets and signs can either increase or decrease anything that they rule over" and yet many alleged experts are oblivious to this :))

Scott Stenwick said...

To be fair, until you do a significant amount of work with them it is less obvious than you might think. When I was starting out decades ago now I would try to do things like banish Saturn to speed things up and remove obstacles. When what really works best is to invoke Saturn to get it done, either by means of a talisman or direct operation. The lack of that knowledge among self-proclaimed experts speaks to their lack of experience, but it also seems to speak to me getting old and keeping up the work this whole time.

The other bit that I rarely see taught is the distinction between planetary paths and sephiroth, and that one took me a while to get too - even though once you see it, the attributions are pretty obvious in Liber 777.

Samat said...

Here's something even deeper for you two. What would be the opposite workings of Kether, Hokmah, and Malkuth?

Bishop said...

So Saturn can be used to speed things up ,i always tought speed was Mercury!
If i want to speed things up ,do i need to be specific with my statament?

Are negative aspects with Ascendent more influental then other aspects in a person s natal chart?

Scott Stenwick said...

@Samat: I am not sure what you mean by opposite workings. Sephiroth run on sphere of influence too, so you do an operation involving Kether, Chockmah, or Malkuth to increase or decrease anything associated with those sephiroth.

@Bishop: Yes, Saturn rules delays, limitations, and restrictions so it can increase or decrease them. Mercury rules motion and communication, so again, it can be used to increase or decrease those. Both can have the effect of speeding things up, but by different means.

As for negative aspects in the natal chart, it really depends on the dynamics of the entire chart. Negative aspects with the Ascendant can be highly influential, but that depends on the planet making the aspect, the planet ruling the rising sign, and what type of aspect it is.

Samat said...

Yes, that is what I meant. To decrease something related to the sphere of the angel's influence. But what does Kether, Hokmah and Malkuth have influence over that they can decrease from someone's life? The signs by their very description are enormously powerful aspects. The sephirots mentioned don't seem so clear to me about what it is they can take away from a person's life besides wisdom (hokmah), knowledge (kether). Do you know?

Scott Stenwick said...

They are pretty general. In Liber 777, they correspond to these powers:

Kether: Union with God.
Chockmah: Vision of God Face-to-Face, Vision of Antinomies.
Malkuth: Vision of the Holy Guardian Angel or of Adonai.

So I guess you could call on them to suppress those visions? I completely fail to see how such a thing would be useful, but it should be possible for whatever it's worth.

Alex Scaraoschi said...

@Scott this would be highly experimental, but the supernals do have diseases associated with them in 777 so I guess suppressing the nefarious influences might help in those cases?!

Scott Stenwick said...

I am not sure that would translate. The supernals are more related to potentiality than anything practical, so I would not expect that to work. I could be wrong, of course, but that would be where the experimentation could come in. Even if that turns out to work to some degree, my guess is that other methods to do the same thing should prove more effective and efficient.

Samat said...

What has been your experience in regard to making you disciplined towards a goal working with Cassiel? Many say that Mars is the appropriate planet for that but I don't see how when Saturn is the planet of persistence. I'm hoping to work with Cassiel for some much needed discipline.

Also, do you use the Shin version of the sigil instead of Samekh?

Scott Stenwick said...

As I see it, Mars is more like motivation and determination. But discipline fits better under Saturn in its role as the ruler of boundaries, restrictions, and persistence. So really, both Mars and Saturn can be related to discipline. It just depends on how you apply them, and I don't see anything wrong with using Saturn for that.

And yes, as I explain in the article where I'm describing the sigil, the spelling that I use is Kaph-Shin-Yod-Aleph-Lamed.

Bishop said...

Does Zodiac sing who rule over countries or locations have a effect on operations ?
For example Libra rules Austria,where i live Capicron lives !I guess libra operations performed in Austria will be more potent?

Mars rules cold weapons right so it can be used in that contexts!And if a person is really active in their life,meeting a lot of people ...there is a chance for operation to work better i guess !

Scott Stenwick said...

I am not sure that zodiacal operations work that way. At least, I have not come across any evidence that they do.

Mars rules weapons in general, cold and otherwise.

Meeting people doesn't lead to more chances for all operations, but it will improve the odds for anything related to interpersonal contact.

Bishop said...

I mean if a person is constantly outside engaged in activites,there s more chance to spell to work it compared to tagret s social inactivity!


Samat said...

Scott, I only noticed this now, but it seems that Liber 777 has no Hebrew name for the planets. Check in Table VI. 'The Heavens of Assiah'. In it, the heavens are attributed to the 7 sephirots as, Nogah for Sephirot of Venus, and the 12 signs and the 5 elements. I think this is an error of Liber 777 itself because the terms Malkuth, Kether, Binah etc are themselves terms for the heavens AS WELL as the name of sephirot represented by those heavens. Why the heaven of Sol - Shemesh - is attributed to Tiphereth is beyond me. Tiphereth rules Shemesh (Sol), Binah rules Shabbatai (Saturn) and so on.

Oh and the phrase 'Cholem Yesodoth' is just a title of Malkuth which means something like World of Elements which only supports this idea.

Scott Stenwick said...

It is not an error, it has to do with how Liber 777 is arranged. The arrangement certainly could have been differently, but that does not make the one we have wrong in any objective way.

Attributing the planets to the sephiroth is standard. Moon is attributed to Yesod, Mercury to Hod, Venus to Netzach, Sun to Tiphareth, Mars to Geburah, Jupiter to Chesed, and Saturn to Binah. Not sure what your issue is there.

I might not be understanding something here and there are a handful of printing errors in 777. But I'm not sure if that's what you're talking about.

Bishop said...

What are a good entity to instill fear in a individual or maybe a group place !
Not a open fear ,or direct threat but more of a subtle but noticable ....like people should approach with caution to you !



Samat said...

This is easily the work of Scorpio or even Capricorn. Fear is an emotion that arises out of danger or from a position of authority and Scorpio (water) and Capricorn (devil card) are both authoritative powers.

Scott Stenwick said...

Those are both possibilities. Also Saturn, if you are looking at planetary work, and Pisces, in the sense of casting illusions. That power can extend to instilling fear.